killerxromances

By the way, i found information after emailing a friend of mine that co-owns a performance shop on that tC i was talking about earlier. He said if i want the actual dyno's to ask.

Heres the info on it: Port polished head, s-pipe, high flow cat and cat back, i/h, stage 2 clutch, crank pulley, and greddy e-manage ulti.

The dyno numbers: Before the head and e-manage 168whp. Thats i/h/e/crank, after the head and e-manage install he dyno'd three numbers at 180, 186, 183whp.

He didn't tell me the conditions in the email but i know they use dyno jet. So, these are by far the highest n/a tc numbers i have even heard of. But, it takes i/h/e/crank/p&p, and a light tune with e-manage to get there.

rhythmnsmoke

I post on SL when I'm at work, just a little FYI for you. All my archives are at home on my computer. You just going to have to wait till I get a chance when I'm at home. It's the weekend on top of that. And I have posted vids. It's not theoretics when someone dyno's a header and Intake, and get 160whp. Do you think they are going to get a drop in hp if they add a full exhaust, NO. When I say FULL EXHAUST, I mean just that. HEADER ALL THE WAY BACK. S-pipe and all. Not just some bent up exhaust that stops at the Cat. or worse than that, at the axel back.




Raced a Subie who has raced STI's and beat them. and I beat the Subie. If you know an STI willing to race, I'll race him too. I know EVO's that won't race, but I'm waiting for one of them to get froggy. But hey, as you so eagerly IMPLY, I'm a pro driver, doing battle against noobs, so I can look good when I post my vids on SL......I confess, you got me. I've been apart of the Nascar cup series of STFU for about 11 years now. I'm also a member of the NHRA

rhythmnsmoke

Sorry, I have to disagree. You take out the cat, and you will pick up more power than that. And I've seen MikeScion dyno at 170whp with I/H/E and crank pulley only. So, a P&P and light tune with e-manage only adds 10whp? For the price of what $500-$1k dollars. That's a load of BS. Dude don't know how to tune or P&P as far as I know.... See how easy it is to shoot holes in another persons argument...

killerxromances

Your also going by mikescion's numbers, which i haven't seen yet. Yep, easy to shoot holes in another persons argument.

As far as how good he is, i honestly don't know. I've heard from others that he does good work, but i haven't actually seen his work nor do i know how well he is at tuning. I would think hes pretty good, but then again i haven't seen it so i can't defend it. But what i do know is, you have yet to show me any dyno proving anything that your saying. I've shown you dyno's, i've showed you quotes from a srt site which i consider a neutral party since none of us know the person i quoted, and is on a totally different site all together.

However, as i've said before. Port a polish if not done to a near perfection won't gain as much, or can actually take away performance. As i've also said before, not all motors respond to mods the same as others. It can very well be the 2az doesn't respond well to head upgrades and mods, do you have any evidence to prove otherwise? If so i'd love to see it.

But back to the topic of tC vs. the world...

rhythmnsmoke

I have done all the same, all with the result of a continuous circle.

Just a little FYI, MikeScion (aka JerseyMike) is just another kid with a tC who likes to race. He's not a mechanic that has a performance shop or anything. He rarely ever gets on SL. You would have to PM him for his dyno sheet.

djrza786

Do you think a Scionlife sticker will make my car faster?

2redgerm6

i raced a 94 civic hatch with an si swap and whooped him. i tried to race a boosted 94 civic hatch. i was driving regular (which is still kinda loud) and he hauled asz around me i heard his blow off as he went around so i thought i would try and catch him at the next light so i got on the gas but didn't down shift (i was in 4th at around 50mph) as soon as i started to match his speed he turned. so i didn't get to see how that would go. but he really didn't seem too fast to me.

killerxromances

Majority of honda motors aren't ideal for boosting, if he boosted the D series motor then you would have easily killed him. The 94 hatch with an Si swap, which Si motor? If you smoked him then it sounds like he possibly mis-shifted because early 90's hatchs are light as hell, with any B series motor they are reasonably fast, with a K series swap i don't think you would have won if you are n/a. Depends on what Si motor though.

...Actually, i know you wouldn't have won if it was ep3 or z1 swap, unless he wasn't familar with the motor yet. *Shrug*

2redgerm6

it was a b16. i know the guy and all he does is race all the time so he is a pretty good shifter. i'll try and get him a couple more times.

killerxromances

Anything else done to it or just a stock b16 swap? Just wondering, because i have a friend with a B16c swap into a del sol and he runs 13's constantly with i/h/e, crank, stage 2 clutch, upgraded injectors and basic management. Once he gets his p&p head, upgrade to stand alone and a slightly larger full exhaust he should be in the 12's.

2redgerm6

i'm pretty sure its stock. i know from expereince that putting a header on a b16 makes a world of difference, but at the most he has an intake. but it just goes to show ya thats a 160 hp motor (just like the tc) that comes from a light car and its swapped into an even lighter car and i still beet him. back when i had my rolla with i/h/e i was about even with 95 civic sis with intake (pretty much a driver race). this whole argument about hp winning races well i prefer to think of it a little diiferent. the way i look at it torque is like hp in the low rpm range and hp is power in the upper rpm range.

killerxromances

Obviously though, theres a huge difference between the jdm b16 and the b16's we get over here.. But, still same concept. If its the 99-00 Si engine stock then it has right around 130-140whp on a 2,100lbs car. Which is why i asked what else was done to it because heres a basic fact sheet:

Hatchback Weight: 2,280lbs (est. depending on model and est. drivers weight)
B16 motor with just say intake: 142whp
Power to weight: 16.05

Your tC weight: 3,100lbs (given your interior set up, plus driver..also rough estimate)
2az motor with your mods: 150whp
Power to weight: 20.66

As you can see, not only is power to weight differences night and day, but thats not taking into effect that the gearing on that Si motor is geared more aggressivly than the 2az, and torque doesn't mean you win especially when you compare it to a car that weighs almost 1,000lbs lighter. The lighter you are, the less torque really matters.

In the end, something sounds way off. It makes no sense that you would win, and less sense that you would "kill" him unless either hes not the best driver, but you said he races all the time..which doesn't mean much, or your lying about it. Now i'm not trying to start anything with you, you seem like a cool guy. But i know a crap load about hondas, how they react to swaps and mods, and power to weight effects + gearing effects since thats most of my experience. I owned a gsr, 231whp n/a raised redline to 8,600rpm, with custom gearing i ran high 12's low 13's with horrible traction in the upper part of 1st and part of 2nd.

2redgerm6

as to me possibly lying. i don't lie. you do have a lot of great #s and honestly i don't know much about hondas or how they react to swapping, except my real life experiences which are me being able to stay even all the time with b16 sis with intake, in my corolla i/h/e thats 130 stock + maybe 20hp at the most to the flywheel. now as far as my car now on the door where THE REAL WEIGHT of a car is its like 3800 pounds.power to weight and all that doesn't matter to me. what matters to me is when i pull away from them. i only raced him once in the tc and i will go after him a couple more time and find out his mods to post. but as far as questioning my character, please don't. if you don't want to believe what i've seen with my own eyes thats your perogative. as stated earlier i could stay with sis with intake in my modded rolla but that same si with i/h/e would destroy me so no doubt it would probably beat the tc as well. but thats not what i raced.

2redgerm6

civic hatches don't way 2280 pounds look on the door where THE REAL WEIGHT is and you will see they are a lot closer to 3200 pounds than you may think. when i talk to the civic hatch owner i will also post his gvw so you aren't looking at the curb weight which is not accurate.

killerxromances

Hey man, the real weight is no where near 3,000lbs. The tC is no where near 4,000lbs. Where are you looking because i honestly haven't looked where your talking about in terms of weight goes, but i know when i had my gsr the weight wasn't posted on the door. I have personally seen a weigh in of a 1996 hatchback with a driver during dyno testing and the weight with a driver was 2,350lbs with a h22 swap, driver, and mods. That is the real weight. So i don't know what your talking about.

I'm not questioning your character, as i said before you seem like a cool guy. But you do admit a Si with i/h/e would defeat you, a hatchback is a good 300lbs lighter than the 99 Si and you are talking about the same motor minus h/e on a car thats lighter. What your saying though makes no sense, specify what weight your talking about because as i've said before, i have personally seen a 96' hatch with a h22 swap register 2,350lbs during dyno testing.

killerxromances

Also, curb weight is the actual weight of any car minus cargo and passengers, or anything else other than the car and whats needed for the motor to run. I.E fuel, tranny fluids, so on. If you don't believe me search any automotive website and it will show you what curb weight is, by definition and how they determine curb weight..I'm sure you could find that out too.

Heres one link i just clicked the first one from yahoo just to show you an example..
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Curb_weight

So i have no idea what your talking about. The weight you might be referring to is the max safe weight the car can handle without causing frame, or other forms of destruction to the car itself. For instance, you can usually find out max cargo weight and/or max passanger weight of any vehicle by the manufacture and/or the internet. I've never recalled seeing this posted on the car itself, but it might be but just never noticed it before. It's not something i look at.

But trust me when i say, the curb weight is actual weight of any car, minus any sort of cargo or driver.

rhythmnsmoke

and trapping at what speed?

2redgerm6

i just researched the weight argument and you are correct i feel like a dumb azz about argueing with you so adamently about the weight when i was wrong the whole time. but that doesn't change my real life experience raceing them.

2redgerm6

how comes i tell you i beat a civic with an intake and you tell my i couldn't have because:

i have a friend with a B16c swap into a del sol and he runs 13's constantly with i/h/e, crank, stage 2 clutch, upgraded injectors and basic management.
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oh and my car was 3055 pounds with me in it. btw thanks.

rhythmnsmoke

Don't ask....