Norma

I am not saying working immigrants are BETTER than welfare moms. Everyone is putting blame on these immigrants who, yes, are here ilegally, but are not freeloaders. Most immigrants aren't here to live off the government.. they are here to work. WHY are lazy ___ american's MY burden and my problem??? Just because those lazy people were born in the US, they can freeload? Yes, i disagree with coming here ilegally but also, this country is pure immigrants.... I don't understand why all of a sudden its a big deal to be an "ilegall imigrant" when we are all imigrants.. and another thing.. WHY is this being fucused mainly on Mexicans... F... my people are not the only one's who come here ilegally. I'm done talking about this subject.

scionofPCFL

I don't know about "better", but I for one have a lot more respect for someone that is going to risk life and limb to traverse a river and a desert to work for peanuts while picking peanuts than for someone who grew up here w/ all of the benefits that the US offers and then only sits around squirtin' out babies that my tax payin hiney has to foot the bill for.

Maicca

Yes, they are working here- is that your definition of "not freeloaders?" When they are getting paid under the table and not paying taxes, how are they NOT freeloaders?

They are here to work, yes. They work illegally for lower wages than is legally possible. The companies who hire them like it becuase their operating expenses are lower, which means they make more money. Why hire a citizen for minimum wage when you can hire 4 illegals for the same price?

Yes, the majority of the US population are descendants of immigrants. However, they either A) got here before any strict laws regarding immigration came about or B) immigrated legally.

As for why can't we just accept 12+ million illegal immigrants into our society because "we're all immigrants," I will have to disagree. They're ILLEGAL. If they filed the correct papers, waited in line, etc. I have no problem. You're confusing people who immigrated here LEGALLY with people who immigrated here ILLEGALLY.

Because the main proportion of the illegal immgrant population is from Mexico. A very large proportion is from Latin America. A much smaller amount is from other areas of the world. These are facts.

Let me make some horrible analogies.

A young couple who recently wedded find out that she is barren. Husband and wife locate a woman of similar background to them both, abduct her, rape her until they are sure that she is pregnant. They then wait around (taking care of the woman) until the baby is born. They proceed to take the baby and leave the woman.


Would you encourage them?



Young couple = illegal immigrants dissatisfied with their country or life.
Woman of similar background = USA
Abduct + rape = coming across the border illegally to work - to produce a desired result.
Taking care of the woman = the "benefit"
Baby = their desired result (green card, citizenship, etc.)

evilBOXevil

BSP_5c10n

[quote="Maicca"]
Um, because they worked for the money? Sorry but I don't think it's possible to consider people who work freeloaders in any sense. People who don't work and leech off of taxpayers are freeloaders. Illegal or not illegal.

scionofPCFL

Whether something is amoral or not is irrelevant of it's legal status.

evilBOXevil

It would be freeloading, if someone who does not pay taxes, begins to demand privileges and protection from a government they do not pay for.

evilBOXevil

This argument is really starting to irritate me.

Let me break this down for you. When I was in High school (in Michigan), I used to do landscaping in the summer and got paid $12 an hour. Nobody pays that much for someone to mow their freakin' lawn anymore. Nobody seeks out these jobs anymore, because there is always somebody coming down the road carrying some strange flag and offering to do it for less.
Do you think that if they legalized every illegal person here today that life would get better??! all of these people would be so happy to go to work in the fields and get paid the minimum wage, and possibly have some other benefits offered, and they could afford a slighlty better life- right? Wrong. A month later they'd show up for work and would be told that they were being fired. The economy is bad..cutbacks..blah blah. And as they left, they'd see their long lost cousin from Wherever-the-hell out there picking in the fields for $3 an hour--just like he used to. Demand lagalization. Demand a fair wage. Be replaced by the next wave of illegals who work for almost nothing. As long as people keep coming illegally, nothing will change...except maybe for the US having alot more jobless people sitting around wishing that they had these $4an hour jobs that used to pay $16.

People always use the arguement that American people wont do these jobs. They do them. The jobs may not pay much more than minimum wage, but people do them.
Truth is that illegal immigrants are not everywhere- at least not in the numbers claimed. People tend to feel this way, but the fact is that where you find these people -they are concentrated in massive numbers...like in California. 15-20 million illegal people in this country? Sure- and the majority of them are in about 5 states. Do they have massive socialistic worker united power over the other 290 million legal people in this country? No..

Your post also has a Mexican flag, which is supposed to have some relevance to this discussion (?)--but in much of America people don't know what that flag is. And they don't send out for foriegn people to clean their houses and bathrooms...American people do it. Sorry to burst your bubble, but most Americans wouldn't think of hiring an illegal person to do their work.

Kilo6_one

pretty self explanatory

so is this one.........
and if someone has the t-shirt making capabilities make this shirt i would buy it.

gnar-de-gwar

It's called the american prison system, it's called the homeless, it's called loafers on welfare. Do you know how many people we could get to do the dirty work "that we wouldnt think twice about doing" and mind you, if you listened in history you wouldve know that during dust bowl, hell even the great depression, that the people that wouldn't think twice about it, did think about it and did it. Why out of necessity, because it needed to be done. If all the beaners (illegal mexicans) were to be all magically caught and sent back to mexico, and the US stopped being such a bunch of pussies and was either more aggressive with defending borders or better yet made a Berlin Wall II (that wall worked WONDERS) and field workers were to be needed and yadayada, I have no doubt that some people will step up to the plate and do what is needed. I personally wouldn't do it, **** I'm a surgical assistant. But the 32 year old male that can't find a job because he didn't finish highschool and has no chance to get a "normal" job would jump right in. Why doesn't he do it now you ask? Because we got the can't speak english for **** and are illegal Jorge and Juan that can do it. Call me inhuman but I say we make the borders like Cambodia and just make them a 5 mile minefield.

scionofPCFL

If those people would do the work, they wouldn't be in prison, they wouldn't be homeless, and they wouldn't be on welfare. But guess what, they are in prison because they chose the quick buck (how you gonna argue with the d-boys making 5g's /week...Hey, you can make $5/hour and wear a goofy hat! whoo hoo), they are homeless because of mental illness/drug & alcohol abuse (a very large portion), and they are on welfare because they don't wanna work or don't have the skills to work, or more likely can't afford to work. Can't afford to work? What they h3!! does that mean? It means that they can't afford to take a $10/ hour job w/no benefits to pay $5/hour for child care and feed and shelter the kiddos.

We've created a monster of a system that is un-Godly complex. There is no easy "let's just build a wall" solution that unwinds 40 years and 3 generations of social assistance.

gnar-de-gwar

that's not the point though, the point is, is that there are able people in the prison system, there are people who are homelss that can work, and there are plenty of people on welfare that have all the capabilities to work. And it's no like "ohhh you should work" it should be more of a "you need to work and do THIS" Prisoners would have no choice, people on welfare, they are in need of a job, a job is offered to them (mowing the lawn, picking strawberries, janitorial work, port-o-potty cleaner) if they don't take it and they are skilled enough (skilled? to clean up my ****? mow my lawn?) and have all the capabilites it would then be mandatory to take it, and either way lose welfare status. Remember they are on welfare because mostly they aren't skilled enough to handle a normal job, the jobs that beaners do take no required skill. The homeless well, that's a different story a smart one who really did want to get back on track, even for a measly box of twinkies and a back rub a day, would take up the offer. The rest, f**k 'em. Back to my point though, if beaners think their illegal asses are SO important to b!tch work, that they are the ONLY ones who will take $3 an hour or $100 or less a day and a free lunch, they are wrong. There are other ways and options to have that labor done beside their illegel a$$es. All in all though my opinions are all idealistic, scoino was right about one thing, "We've created a monster of a system that is un-Godly complex. There is no easy "let's just build a wall" solution that unwinds 40 years and 3 generations of social assistance." Not to mention the US doesnt have the ***** to do it let alone even DRAFT it.

scionofPCFL

Idealistically speaking, I'd change a crap load of crap. Unfortunately, everytime I start thinking like that, I get hit the face with a crap load of reality.

Maicca

That's a lot of crap.

JMD83

Just want to chime in and say that I so far have completely agreed with the statements made by Supermod "Tomas".

R2D2

EVERYBODY IN THE U.S.A IS AN IMMIGRANT.
I do agree we Americans should (and do) have limitations on people entering the U.S.A., but to say "...this or that - person doesn't belong here..." ____ES ME OFF because of the fact that this land was stolen/robbed/cheated from people who believed that all Land belongs to everybody/everything to share.
There is no simple solution to this issue, however to kick people out on the basis that they're not natives is being the ULTIMATE HYPOCRITE.
What I don't get is why were people holding up Mexican (or their countries of origin) flags at the May day march??? Wasn't their purpose to U.S. legalization for themselves? Funny...
Anyways, All people deserve a chance. I believe that starts @ birth, therefore if one wants to be apart of a "land of opportunity", than be apart of making your land better instead of attempting to hop on the bandwagon.
For the ones already here, until proven unworthy I think they deserve the minimum of a chance until proven otherwise.
Just my opinion

Maicca

1.) Unless you're talking about the Middle East (when most people credit humanity as beginning) everyone in every country on the planet is then an immigrant, by your logic.

2.)We're not kicking anyone out for not being natives- we're kicking them out for being here illegally.

R2D2

1.) Yup, in essence..
2.) The "illegally" ur referring to is hypocritical because it was made up by "illegals" who've proclaimed themselves "legal". Therefore, according to "their" logic whoever wasn't "their" color, religion, race, etc...was therefore proclaimed "illegal" (even the Native Americans themselves became illegal with that logic).

Scott17

Your logic ain't.

R2D2

^ KKK uncloaked (if you don't believe me just read his posts)...