BSP_5c10n

Oh and just in case you idiots forgot... We are a country of immigrants. We always have been since colonial times. You think everyone spoke the same language when they first arrived here hundreds of years ago? People from all over Europe came here looking for the same thing that the immigrants of today are looking for... opportunity. So case freakin closed on that one.

Some of you people need to put yourself in the other person's shoes for once. Most of you all (including myself) have been fortunate enough to be born here in America. Imagine being born in a third world country where you risk starvation and other injustices. I'm sure you'd be on the first boat/van/raft/truck over here. I can't believe how ill informed some of you people are.

Scott17

We are a country of immigrants that ASSIMULATED to a collective group that now has OUR OWN culture. Those european immigrants became citizens and took an oath to defend and represent ONE flag and ONE country. I have no problem with LEGAL Mexican immigrants. If you are defending the ILLEGAL immigration into our country, who's the idiot?

BSP_5c10n

Oh by the way... For all you conservative flag-wavers out there... It's BUSH that wants to grant amnesty to the illegal immigrants.

BSP_5c10n

Well if this new immigration bill passes... All 20 million (or 12 million, really no one knows the exact number of illegal immigrants in this country, since they're illegal) illegal immigrants will be granted amnesty and a guest worker program will be established, embracing more immigration into this country. Since this will all be LEGAL, you shouldn't have any problems then.

Scott17

Nothing like a 19 year old liberal who cant comprehend the news. And if you aren't an AMERICAN flag waver, why don't you go live in the country of the flag you choose to wave.(right after you mow my lawn).

BSP_5c10n

Nothing like a 42 year old moron who doesn't read the news. Explain what I failed to comprehend, mister.

daramg

Looking at the stupid comments you made thus far, you have a problem with Mexicans in general....

Scott17

These workers will be DOCUMENTED and won't be our guest SPONGES.

BSP_5c10n

I choose towave the flag of the country where ALL MEN ARE CREATED EQUAL. Which happens to be the AMERICAN flag. I never said I was anti-american. You obviously can't comprehend this 19 year old's posts.

Scott17

I am not a fan of ILLEGAL ALIENS of ANY color, race or creed. If you live in this country as a citizen you are an AMERICAN. If you consider yourself a Mexican, why not go live in Mexico. I have German ancesters. I don't go aroung referring to myself as German. I,m AMERICAN! NOT German-American, American-German or any such else nonsense, AMERICAN! Get with the program of our country if you choose to live in it or else go to wherever it is you think you belong.

BSP_5c10n

Yeah well millions of mexicans are about to become AMERICANS if this bill passes. How do you feel about that? Sounds like YOU need to get with the program.

Scott17

I will welcome them to this country and help them any way I can. I have nothing againt a guy with a year-round tan, if we're on the same team. He would be an AMERICAN, same as any( or an invited guest worker).

BSP_5c10n

I just love how all these people on here are bashing liberals left and right (no pun intended) and yet who is all for giving amnesty to those who entered the U.S. illegally? That's right! Mr. George W. Bush himself. If you're worried about mexicans overrunning us and taking over America (which many of you seem to believe is occuring right now) then you elected the wrong president.

vegasdriver

Here is a great comparison of Rome and the USA which was posted on another forum:
" Immigrants and non-Roman citizens WERE a tremendous problem that helped pave the way for the destruction of the empire. Originally, only Romans could be citizens. And, only Romans were expected to serve in the army. At a certain point, the need for troops began to outweight the citizen contribution, so they enacted a program very similar to our own whereby you could earn citizenship through military service. As the empire continued to grow, non-citizens were increasingly gaining positions of power and influence and some had closer loyalties to their ethnic brothers than to Rome. At various points in history the emperors conferred Roman citizenship upon great numbers of people that they had conquered.

These people influenced the direction of Roman history. As citizens of Rome they were entitled to the same priveleges that ethnic Roman citizens were. They took jobs and land that would normally have been reserved for the traditional citizens. Barbarian tribes began to frequently invade and settle in Roman lands, demanding concessions and various degrees of autonomy in exchange for not pillaging even more. The effect was that the population of the Empire began to become increasingly loyal to their own ethnic groups rather than Rome. Many of the later Western emperors were truly incompetent, but many of the problems that they bungled were related to this immigrant population.

As more and more provinces rebelled and as the barbarian tribes became more and more powerful (and wanted to move further and further south) Rome became increasingly dependent on soldiers that were either foreign or new citizens. It's hard to tell a foreign born general what to do when he has twenty thousand troops under his command. Immigration did not bring down the empire. But it certainly was a major contributer to the political, economic, and military problems that eventually brought the western empire down. The dillution of "Romans" from the Roman economic system caused great strain on the empire and helped to create a situation that the emperors were not able to deal with.

I think that the Rome/USA comparison that is made is on target. Immigration and "citizenship" are issues in both examples, the US and Rome. It creates problems for both the existing citizens and the new comers. It dilutes the national identity of both Romans and Americans. It helps to create a strong underclass that, eventually, will want to be on top. There are many, many valid comparisons."

jeffrgunn23

Belive it or not most conservitives don't agree with Bush on every issue. But I guess what your saying is you agree with Bush on this? I havn't read one thing on here that said that anyone was affraid Mexican's overrunning us, I have only read that people wanted ILLIGAL immagrants removed. I think we all feel that there is nothing wrong with immigration as long as the right steps were taken to become citizens.

Also if you look at the news this is in no way a republican vs. democrat debate. There are many republicans for and against this bill as well as democrats for and against it.

fastandcurious

apparently, texas must be very different from california. i live 15 minutes from glendale, a city where i can't communicate with half the people because i don't speak armenian. i live 5 minutes from chinatown where i can't communicate with half the people there because i don't speak chinese. i live 15 minutes from korea town, where i can't communicate with half the people there because i don't speak korean. i can go on and on, but back to my point: since when did the word "immigrant" become synonymous with the spanish language? hit the books, son!

BSP_5c10n

You know the thing is... If the incentives for illegal immigrants were taken away, then there wouldn't be illegal immigration. Instead of punishing the illegal immigrants, the people in America who brought them here, or are hiring them should be punished.

It's similar (although not exact) to the situation of African-Americans and slavery. Very few people had a problem with Africans being brought to the United States as slaves. However, once the abolitionist movement succeeded, these slaves were made free. No longer slaves, yet were denied the rights enjoyed by white Americans. Once they began to speak up during the Civil Rights movement, people had a problem with it. It's almost as if many of you are willing to look the other way when it comes to injustices in the world, until you feel threatened by it. It seems that you wouldn't have a problem with Mexicans being brought into the U.S. illegally, as long as you didn't have to "pay your tax money" for it.

Now, to refute any argument stating "Oh but the blacks were forced into coming here. The Mexicans are coming here on there own. It's different." Let me just say I am aware of this, however let me ask you this: If you were making 5 dollars a day in Mexico versus 60 across the border, wouldn't you feel almost forced to leave your country to find a job with enough pay to feed your family? I think you would.

Of course, you'd be okay with all this. Heck, they're doing the jobs you don't want to do. It's okay as long as you don't have to foot the bill for it. It's like "Well it doesn't affect me, so whatever." Well, now millions of illegals currently reside in the U.S., and now you feel it's affecting you. Well it's too late. And who is to blame? Not the illegal immigrants, but those who hired them and gave them incentive to come here.

rhythmnsmoke

There are two "THEY" I'm talking about. (ps..the damn SL server is making me post under my g/f name, have not figured it out yet why it keeps doing that). But I'm the one that typed that. And when I said "THEY" I was refereing to ANYONE who can't speak English. Primarily that would be people from the Latin countries, but not just them. But they do make up a hefty % of NON-English speaking people that occupy this country.

The second "THEY" I was refering to was the Government. They use our tax dollars for some of the stupidest crap. They can use it to setup a MANDATORY program....KEY WORD MANDATORY.

Scott17

Spoken like a true liberal without much experience under his belt.

BSP_5c10n

I never said it was a Republican vs. Democrat debate. There are many liberal democrats, as well as democrats that lean more toward the conservative side. It is the same with the republicans. However there are some people on here who feel it is a liberal vs. conservative debate. I was making the argument that Bush, who is commonly viewed as a conservative president, was in favor of this immigration bill. I was refuting the statements from those on here that feel it is the liberals that are all for condoning illegal immigration. Therefore, it is hardly a liberal vs. conservative debate either. There are pros and cons from both sides of the spectrum.