View Poll Results: PC versus MAC
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PC versus MAC
03-28-2007, 12:30 AM
#81
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Originally Posted by WeDriveScions
It's pretty evident that the credibility and tact reside on the side of the MAC users, as you resort to cynical talk and broud statements to defend your weaker position.
Realistically, there's evidence to show that component wise, a PC can be built to be faster for cheaper, but it still doesn't account for reliability, software security, OS compatibility and STABILITY, and 0 building time, or tweaking time to get things all talking and working together.
MOST people don't wish or desire to invest the time, energy, study, and frustration involved with picking and choosing between the 1000's of PC components out there to build a "Superior" machine... Like me, many would rather pay a small premium to have a well researched, HIGHLY reviewed, and VERY Progressive MAC right out of the Box.
Addressing on cost alone is a weak argument, as in life, MANY, MANY examples are out there of why individuals spend more money for products, than their less expensive comparisons... Kia/Scion, Nike/Payless, Purebread/Mutt, Harvard/Community College....
It's all about a thousand little things and reasons why people choose to pay more.... Marketing/High Reviews/Out of the Box Performance/Reliability/Stability/Features/Looks/Progressiveness/Low Maintenence/Association/Developement/Simplicity/Security.... and on and on are on the side of the MAC, I'd give up on the arguement of price for any of those, any day.
Add in the neccesity to continually have to upgrade, along with the intensely higher amount of code involved to make an OS work with thousands of different possible components, along with the reality that the OS developement from Microsoft is now lagging behind that of Apple and their progressive development in OSX and coming up with their new OS update.... it just starts to stack the deck...
all true to some extent that my mac-addiction will only partly let me recognize
Just for Cynical Sake... the following entertainment...
.
Realistically, there's evidence to show that component wise, a PC can be built to be faster for cheaper, but it still doesn't account for reliability, software security, OS compatibility and STABILITY, and 0 building time, or tweaking time to get things all talking and working together.
MOST people don't wish or desire to invest the time, energy, study, and frustration involved with picking and choosing between the 1000's of PC components out there to build a "Superior" machine... Like me, many would rather pay a small premium to have a well researched, HIGHLY reviewed, and VERY Progressive MAC right out of the Box.
Addressing on cost alone is a weak argument, as in life, MANY, MANY examples are out there of why individuals spend more money for products, than their less expensive comparisons... Kia/Scion, Nike/Payless, Purebread/Mutt, Harvard/Community College....
It's all about a thousand little things and reasons why people choose to pay more.... Marketing/High Reviews/Out of the Box Performance/Reliability/Stability/Features/Looks/Progressiveness/Low Maintenence/Association/Developement/Simplicity/Security.... and on and on are on the side of the MAC, I'd give up on the arguement of price for any of those, any day.
Add in the neccesity to continually have to upgrade, along with the intensely higher amount of code involved to make an OS work with thousands of different possible components, along with the reality that the OS developement from Microsoft is now lagging behind that of Apple and their progressive development in OSX and coming up with their new OS update.... it just starts to stack the deck...
all true to some extent that my mac-addiction will only partly let me recognize
Just for Cynical Sake... the following entertainment...
.
03-28-2007, 12:36 AM
#82
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Originally Posted by WeDriveScions
It's pretty evident that the credibility and tact reside on the side of the MAC users, as you resort to cynical talk and broud(sp) statements to defend your weaker position.
PLUS, my car is cooler than yours, so my opinion counts more.
So there.... and my dad can woop your dad.
PLUS, my car is cooler than yours, so my opinion counts more.
So there.... and my dad can woop your dad.
03-28-2007, 12:45 AM
#83
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Originally Posted by dmpsk8
u just cant teach some people. we have both macs and pcs in my production studio where we r runnin way more intense stuff than just photoshop and illustrator 
the PCs we have are pretty pimped but they DO NOT run anywhere near as reliable as macs. u can start talin individual components but it makes no difference. If u got a v8 in rusted out '88 cavilier, its still a piece of crap. this is as bad as comparin 3ds to Maya. there is no comparison here.
the PCs we have are pretty pimped but they DO NOT run anywhere near as reliable as macs. u can start talin individual components but it makes no difference. If u got a v8 in rusted out '88 cavilier, its still a piece of crap. this is as bad as comparin 3ds to Maya. there is no comparison here.Again I have to emphasize that not everyone who has a pc runs Vista or even windows in general. There is more to the pc realm than micro$oft.
03-28-2007, 01:04 AM
#84
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Yeah, studios use Macs 'cause they have nice cases 
Not to worry, TV stations and movie studios use rendering farms made up of Macs and SUNs and other high-end boxes.
I can assure you that none of our studios use them because they look good, although that's a nice side.
As for Mac users being "fill in the blank" it comes down to PC guys that seem to be SOOOOO HAPPPY, yet need to troll Mac forums and Mac sites and talk smack. Over the years, you get sick of it, but you have to laugh too because my colleagues spend so much time and money supporting the Windows security issues, bad hardware, etc.
And if Apple is indeed using the same parts, then why do they work so much better?
Why so few DOAs?
Dunno. You guys can bait all you want in your Yugos. I'll keep my solid, fast, reliable and yes, VERY COOL LOOKING Apple Macs.
Now guys, off with you and your Zunes - I hear they just released a new PINK one - that ought to boost sales...
Not to worry, TV stations and movie studios use rendering farms made up of Macs and SUNs and other high-end boxes.
I can assure you that none of our studios use them because they look good, although that's a nice side.
As for Mac users being "fill in the blank" it comes down to PC guys that seem to be SOOOOO HAPPPY, yet need to troll Mac forums and Mac sites and talk smack. Over the years, you get sick of it, but you have to laugh too because my colleagues spend so much time and money supporting the Windows security issues, bad hardware, etc.
And if Apple is indeed using the same parts, then why do they work so much better?
Why so few DOAs?
Dunno. You guys can bait all you want in your Yugos. I'll keep my solid, fast, reliable and yes, VERY COOL LOOKING Apple Macs.
Now guys, off with you and your Zunes - I hear they just released a new PINK one - that ought to boost sales...
03-28-2007, 01:17 AM
#85
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Like I just said, macs do tend to be faster at rendering. Hence your farms.
I've also never been to a mac site. But I have been in PC gaming forums and have gotten at least a dozen mac users flaming me. So maybe each side of the argument has their share of asshats that like to troll.
As far as security, Windoze does suck, but I have been working with computers since Vic 20's and commodore 64's and I never got one virus until a few years ago when pretty much every not up to date xp was hit with the same virus. I haven't gotten hit since. Virus susceptibility tends to be mainly between the keyboard and the chair. I use linux now for everything non-gaming which is insanely more secure than windows.
Oh and I have an ipod (not a zune) and mentioned it earlier. It is a nice product, although I'm not happy with all the "functions" and hate itunes (so I uninstalled it and use other programs instead).
As for the DOA's, do you have records comparing DOA's for various companies and the various products? I'd be interested in seeing what companies make/resell the crappy products.
03-28-2007, 01:26 AM
#86
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in the long run, to each his own.
03-28-2007, 01:33 AM
#87
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Originally Posted by Skeorx13
Like I just said, macs do tend to be faster at rendering. Hence your farms.
I've also never been to a mac site. But I have been in PC gaming forums and have gotten at least a dozen mac users flaming me. So maybe each side of the argument has their share of asshats that like to troll.
As far as security, Windoze does suck, but I have been working with computers since Vic 20's and commodore 64's and I never got one virus until a few years ago when pretty much every not up to date xp was hit with the same virus. I haven't gotten hit since. Virus susceptibility tends to be mainly between the keyboard and the chair. I use linux now for everything non-gaming which is insanely more secure than windows.
Oh and I have an ipod (not a zune) and mentioned it earlier. It is a nice product, although I'm not happy with all the "functions" and hate itunes (so I uninstalled it and use other programs instead).
As for the DOA's, do you have records comparing DOA's for various companies and the various products? I'd be interesting in seeing what companies make/resell the crappy products.
Yes, I'm sure some Mac guys do the same crap, I'm just explaining it from my perspective.
Viruses are in big part user-induced, but the fact remains that if my Mom or Grandma wants to use a computer, they shouldn't have to be smarter than the computer or the a**holes that create such code.
Hence, the Mac/Linux world is superior.
As for a list of crappy products, I already mentioned the big players, but I can't publish any data about the company.
I still like my position here
03-28-2007, 02:24 AM
#88
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Yea! I love the overanalysis... it's all too simple... maybe that's why the PC guys don't get it....
I drag and drop program installs, I don't worry about dll crap, Apple open sources driver code which Vista doesn't, and on and on... Unfortunately, only a few geeks out there compared to the overall public aren't driven by the Microsoft Yugo, and their PCs will always suffer for it... overcomplicated code, poor security, poor stability, and poor performance (for the GENERAL NON-Geeked public) is why I have been pulled over the the MAC side....
Most of the pro-pc arguements deny the usability for the general non-geeked up public and demand either research, education, or a decent amount of computer knowledge to get past all the shortcomings of the PC....
A Mac needs none of that.... My grandma can get the same power/security/reliability/performance as me... Give her, or probably 70 plus percent of the computer buying public a PC, and cross your fingers, as it'll be a spyware/spammed/virus laided brick in no time, unless they got a geek around to set them up, or just get plain lucky...
That's the big point...
I drag and drop program installs, I don't worry about dll crap, Apple open sources driver code which Vista doesn't, and on and on... Unfortunately, only a few geeks out there compared to the overall public aren't driven by the Microsoft Yugo, and their PCs will always suffer for it... overcomplicated code, poor security, poor stability, and poor performance (for the GENERAL NON-Geeked public) is why I have been pulled over the the MAC side....
Most of the pro-pc arguements deny the usability for the general non-geeked up public and demand either research, education, or a decent amount of computer knowledge to get past all the shortcomings of the PC....
A Mac needs none of that.... My grandma can get the same power/security/reliability/performance as me... Give her, or probably 70 plus percent of the computer buying public a PC, and cross your fingers, as it'll be a spyware/spammed/virus laided brick in no time, unless they got a geek around to set them up, or just get plain lucky...
That's the big point...
03-28-2007, 04:06 PM
#89
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for the dumb computer user who needs to buy an expensive machine just so they can get email and surf the web, or make home movies no one wants to watch anyway, then they should get a mac, sure.
If you actually know about computers or play video games then build your pc. As my generaton a nd every one younger gets older, and you got 50+% of the population playing video games, it's really going to tip farther onto the pc side.
Mac's were better 7+ years ago for flat graphics. I really don't keep up with 3d rendering software, but my dad/step mom both work at lockheed working on 3d models of aircraft/missles, they were using macs 5+ years ago. now they got dual and quad xenon pcs. and since most graphic professionals are either taught at school(which still have you learning on 5+ year old macs) or have been in the business for 10+ years, yeah they have macs, and that's why design firms use them. That'll change soon enough.
btw, we're just about the only country in the world that use macs.
Overpriced? Hardly supported? sounds like Macs are the domestic car of the computer world, huh? The two biggest upcoming powerhouses in the world india and china have nothing to do with macs. think japan does either? When you really think about it, macs seem to be a silly little american niche product.
If you actually know about computers or play video games then build your pc. As my generaton a nd every one younger gets older, and you got 50+% of the population playing video games, it's really going to tip farther onto the pc side.
Mac's were better 7+ years ago for flat graphics. I really don't keep up with 3d rendering software, but my dad/step mom both work at lockheed working on 3d models of aircraft/missles, they were using macs 5+ years ago. now they got dual and quad xenon pcs. and since most graphic professionals are either taught at school(which still have you learning on 5+ year old macs) or have been in the business for 10+ years, yeah they have macs, and that's why design firms use them. That'll change soon enough.
Originally Posted by WeDriveScions
There's always PC guys out there who will fight to the death about quality/features/price/upgradability.... and I think most of them still drive domestics too.
Overpriced? Hardly supported? sounds like Macs are the domestic car of the computer world, huh? The two biggest upcoming powerhouses in the world india and china have nothing to do with macs. think japan does either? When you really think about it, macs seem to be a silly little american niche product.
03-28-2007, 05:03 PM
#90
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that post seemed a bit angry.
03-28-2007, 05:04 PM
#91
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i'm not ever angry here.
03-28-2007, 05:09 PM
#92
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Dave, stick to WoW and leave data for those that don't spend all-day playing.
You're much better off that way.
You're much better off that way.
03-28-2007, 05:25 PM
#93
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if I played WoW, or any other mmo, this would not be the bbs I would post on.
03-29-2007, 02:12 AM
#94
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I love Seattle Dave.... he's an emotional dude...
Rationalizing that if you don't have the knowledge to build, troubleshoot, or research all the neccesary parts to build a solid PC = DUMB?
^ That is very flawed logic... as there are many brilliant individuals who don't wish to spend the time, or constantly stay up to date on the needed info to continue to build neccesary machines to stay up to date and competive against the powerfully build Macs.
Now.... Here's a Logic Lesson-
Neccesitating research/knowledge/troubleshooting ability to use a product well or make it good = POOR Concept and DESIGN
^ Good Logic and SOLID business Model to create different, hence the Apple Business Model and Focus on Usability/Performance/Safety/Stability for not only the average person, but strong feature set for the professional.... SEE the new Adobe CS3!
And a large factor of product quality is sheer usability, especially in the combined hardware/software world...
Rationalizing that if you don't have the knowledge to build, troubleshoot, or research all the neccesary parts to build a solid PC = DUMB?
^ That is very flawed logic... as there are many brilliant individuals who don't wish to spend the time, or constantly stay up to date on the needed info to continue to build neccesary machines to stay up to date and competive against the powerfully build Macs.
Now.... Here's a Logic Lesson-
Neccesitating research/knowledge/troubleshooting ability to use a product well or make it good = POOR Concept and DESIGN
^ Good Logic and SOLID business Model to create different, hence the Apple Business Model and Focus on Usability/Performance/Safety/Stability for not only the average person, but strong feature set for the professional.... SEE the new Adobe CS3!
And a large factor of product quality is sheer usability, especially in the combined hardware/software world...
03-29-2007, 02:19 AM
#95
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Well, I was done here, but I had to say that Dave thinks a box (case) is a box and he thinks Apple charges too much for a "pretty one"
Well, got news for Dave, that case is pretty impressive.
It's got 9-11 fans and 3-4 separate columns for air as well as temp sensors on all those hot spots to regulate the temps.
I also don't have to use tools to change most of the parts.
And finally, yes, it's purdy.
It's top-notch.
Nothing like it in his Lego-PC world, and he's happy apparently.
Which again, is fine, but for him to talk the crap he has about Macs is laughable.
He has time to build a PC - wow.
I just built a server - yes Dave, BUILT it.
It took a week just to put it all together.
It's very complex, and I have about another 10 days of configuring it for use.
And believe it or not, I couldn't and didn't learn how to in a free rag at Ralph's.
Well, got news for Dave, that case is pretty impressive.
It's got 9-11 fans and 3-4 separate columns for air as well as temp sensors on all those hot spots to regulate the temps.
I also don't have to use tools to change most of the parts.
And finally, yes, it's purdy.
It's top-notch.
Nothing like it in his Lego-PC world, and he's happy apparently.
Which again, is fine, but for him to talk the crap he has about Macs is laughable.
He has time to build a PC - wow.
I just built a server - yes Dave, BUILT it.
It took a week just to put it all together.
It's very complex, and I have about another 10 days of configuring it for use.
And believe it or not, I couldn't and didn't learn how to in a free rag at Ralph's.
03-29-2007, 06:39 AM
#96
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I'm a PC guy. I get tired of windows ____ing up though. You learn to maintain it. Its when you've been bald forever and then all of a sudden you grow you hair out and start styling again. Okay maybe that was a bad analogy.
I'm a sound engineer. Macs are standard in the industry because supposedly Pro Tools is the industry standard. Thats on a whole different level of marketing though...
I like windows but... Macs are somewhat less buggy and annoying. I can't get used to the one mouse button thing though...
If you want upgradability PCs are awesome. I built mine. $800. You know h ow much a freakin mac book pro is? Give me a damn break. To get a decent audio workstation is about $3000 not to mention Pro Tools HD, another $3000+.
Recockulous.
I'm a sound engineer. Macs are standard in the industry because supposedly Pro Tools is the industry standard. Thats on a whole different level of marketing though...
I like windows but... Macs are somewhat less buggy and annoying. I can't get used to the one mouse button thing though...
If you want upgradability PCs are awesome. I built mine. $800. You know h ow much a freakin mac book pro is? Give me a damn break. To get a decent audio workstation is about $3000 not to mention Pro Tools HD, another $3000+.
Recockulous.
03-29-2007, 06:57 AM
#97
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one the note of zune vs ipod. i like ipods but mine has taken multiple craps on me and is now totally dead after about 2 years. battery change and all. a waste. I want the 80 gig video alltho i wouldn't use the video portion , oh well. but i've lost all my playlists. very , very sad 
argh. i just wanna throw the next ipod I see up against a wall.
the zune's are SICK just not enough capacity.
argh. i just wanna throw the next ipod I see up against a wall.
the zune's are SICK just not enough capacity.
03-29-2007, 01:03 PM
#98
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I like windows but... Macs are somewhat less buggy and annoying. I can't get used to the one mouse button thing though
btw, you have more choices than just the high end Mac Pros, unless you want to compare them to the high end Dells and Alienware pcs. Mac's start at $999 with 17" LCD monitor, and the minis start at $599.
So I ask you: $1000 bucks for a clean, slick looking machine free of most wires and viri, with rock solid stability, easiest to use, lots of built in usable software, and right out of the box operation. Or 800 bucks for a clunky box and monitor with wires jutting out of all directions, an OS that needs a daily security update, the stability of an upside down pyramid, needs a hardware upgrade every 6 mos, and mountains of preloaded crap from Disney, AOL, et al?
03-29-2007, 04:44 PM
#99
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Originally Posted by scionofPCFL
I like windows but... Macs are somewhat less buggy and annoying. I can't get used to the one mouse button thing though
btw, you have more choices than just the high end Mac Pros, unless you want to compare them to the high end Dells and Alienware pcs. Mac's start at $999 with 17" LCD monitor, and the minis start at $599.
So I ask you: $1000 bucks for a clean, slick looking machine free of most wires and viri, with rock solid stability, easiest to use, lots of built in usable software, and right out of the box operation. Or 800 bucks for a clunky box and monitor with wires jutting out of all directions, an OS that needs a daily security update, the stability of an upside down pyramid, needs a hardware upgrade every 6 mos, and mountains of preloaded crap from Disney, AOL, et al?
Those iMacs running at $999 are great computers don't get me wrong. But some people have different needs. A basic computer user CAN buy a mac book and fall in LOVE with it. And thats great! But I need power. Obviously the switch to the intel dual cores have had a tremendous effect, and its great because people like me, sound engineers, will be able to multitask and run pro tools and even more plug ins! Yay! I can't settle with apples low end models. I have to have a pro for what I do (if I were to get one, and I eventually I will probably have to). THe mac book pros are about $2,300 with my school discount? I can probably get a PC with the same power for about $1,700 or less.
Viruses? i haven't had a virus in probably 2 years. If I catch one from doing something stupid like downloading, not only is that my bad, but my computer catches it fast. It's a horrible thing, but thats the way the OS developed... Stupid people doing stupid ____. Now we have to worry about spam and bull____ on social networking sites like myspace that are just annoying as hell.
03-29-2007, 05:15 PM
#100
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But some people have different needs.