Southeast PA General Discussion - NJ/DE/MD welcome too!
07-18-2007, 08:00 PM
#542
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Originally Posted by Big_Jim
you shouldnt be at all.
i'm on 19x8's dropped at least 2.5 inches.......
i'm on 19x8's dropped at least 2.5 inches.......
What springs do u have that gave u 2.5?
07-18-2007, 08:07 PM
#543
i have progress technology springs, but they've settled out way lower than they should. remember i have 3 fat chicks as a stereo? my car is lower than ed's lol.
the progress springs only give u 1.8 too...... my first springs that were even lower than these were the RS*R down springs, imported from japan. those were even lower. had to switch them out to fir my first set of 19's.
the progress springs only give u 1.8 too...... my first springs that were even lower than these were the RS*R down springs, imported from japan. those were even lower. had to switch them out to fir my first set of 19's.
07-18-2007, 08:37 PM
#548
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its really sad when i spent 2,000 dollars in gas and about 25,000 miles on my last car to go to PSU everyweekend someimes twice a weekend to see my GF because she was upset and didnt wanna be alone and when i ask her to borrow 800 of the 10,000 she has and pay it back to her within 3 months and she says no....sorry i just had to vent haha it just ____es me off when i do stuff and favors for people and when i ask i get nada thing
07-18-2007, 08:41 PM
#549
^^ its part of life.
and Scott. Not everyone can drop 700+ for coilovers to go lower. think if he spends the 160 on df210's and sells his springs now for 125. then it only cost him what, $35? not too bah.
and Scott. Not everyone can drop 700+ for coilovers to go lower. think if he spends the 160 on df210's and sells his springs now for 125. then it only cost him what, $35? not too bah.
07-18-2007, 09:14 PM
#551
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if your gonna get lower springs. at least get shocks and struts and do it the right way. or just save up and buy coil-overs. ask zack, im sure he regrets not getting coil-over from the start. you can go as low as you want then raise it back up in the winter.
why not to run stock shocks
Automotive springs are rated by their stiffness and the amount of pressure it takes to compress them. now think about any spring you've ever handled. even a ball point pen spring. the stiffer the spring, the further it is going to travel when compressed and then decompressed. if you take a very stiff ball point pen spring and compress it then let it go, it will shoot across the room much further than a soft spring....correct? OK, if you understand that basic dynamic, you can now understand automotive suspension.
the job of a shock/strut is to limit the travel of the car's springs, and absorb impact from bumps. think about what we just said about pen springs, if you put springs on a car w/out shocks/struts, the body of the car would constantly be bouncing around on the suspension, making it impossible to control. now, most cars....like our GTi....use a mono-tube gas shock, which means the piston of the shock is attached to a valve inside the shock body which is filled with compressed gas. when your car hits a bump the springs compress, which causes the shock to compress....this is called bound. because our shocks are fairly heavy duty, the compressed air does a very good job of absorbing the impact and limiting how far the spring will compress....HOWEVER, when the spring DEcompresses (like after the bump, or when entering a tight turn where the car's weight wants to continue going straight, therefore trying to decompress the spring) this is where the stock equipment falls short. because the valve in the shock is 1 way, the gas pressure extends the shock, which is why if you take a stock shock and compress it all the way, when you let go, the rod extends by itself. that is why the ride quality of our cars is very stiff when you hit a bump, but when you enter a tight turn you get a decent amount of body roll, because a monotube shock design does a great job of absorbing the energy when a spring tries to compress, but because of the gas pressure built up in the shock body, it doesnt do a very good job of limiting the travel of the spring as it DE-compresses. so therefore, when you add a lowering spring with MUCH higher spring rates (think about the stiffer pen spring) the force exerted by the spring as it DEcompresses is much MUCH higher and since our stock shocks dont do a very good job of limiting the travel of the STOCK springs, when you add lowering springs, the body roll becomes much more pronounced.
Now onto performance shocks/struts. these are filled with oil, and the valves at the end of the shock rods are two way valves which means that the oil travels THROUGH the valve as the shock compresses, which means that a similar force (depending on the valving) must be exerted to DEcompress the shock rod (extend it), which is why if you hand compress a high performance shock, the shock rod will stay down unless you pull it up (which on konis like mine, takes ALOT of force). this is why handling is DRASTICALLY improved with a performance shock/strut, because of the increased force needed to extend the shock rod, the majority of the force exerted as the spring DEcompresses is absorbed. This is why body roll and suspension travel is SIGNIFICANTLY reduced by using a performance shock, hence, increasing the cars handling capabilities.
PS: because of drastic increase of force exerted by a performance spring as it decompresses, the pressure on the STOCK shocks is significantly increased which will cause it to wear out quicker, usually in HALF the time that it normally would. it's not me justifying the $$ i spent on my shocks....it's just a fact, just like if you add 600lbs to your car the brakes will wear out quicker because it takes more work to stop the momentum of the car. hope this helped
why not to run stock shocks
Automotive springs are rated by their stiffness and the amount of pressure it takes to compress them. now think about any spring you've ever handled. even a ball point pen spring. the stiffer the spring, the further it is going to travel when compressed and then decompressed. if you take a very stiff ball point pen spring and compress it then let it go, it will shoot across the room much further than a soft spring....correct? OK, if you understand that basic dynamic, you can now understand automotive suspension.
the job of a shock/strut is to limit the travel of the car's springs, and absorb impact from bumps. think about what we just said about pen springs, if you put springs on a car w/out shocks/struts, the body of the car would constantly be bouncing around on the suspension, making it impossible to control. now, most cars....like our GTi....use a mono-tube gas shock, which means the piston of the shock is attached to a valve inside the shock body which is filled with compressed gas. when your car hits a bump the springs compress, which causes the shock to compress....this is called bound. because our shocks are fairly heavy duty, the compressed air does a very good job of absorbing the impact and limiting how far the spring will compress....HOWEVER, when the spring DEcompresses (like after the bump, or when entering a tight turn where the car's weight wants to continue going straight, therefore trying to decompress the spring) this is where the stock equipment falls short. because the valve in the shock is 1 way, the gas pressure extends the shock, which is why if you take a stock shock and compress it all the way, when you let go, the rod extends by itself. that is why the ride quality of our cars is very stiff when you hit a bump, but when you enter a tight turn you get a decent amount of body roll, because a monotube shock design does a great job of absorbing the energy when a spring tries to compress, but because of the gas pressure built up in the shock body, it doesnt do a very good job of limiting the travel of the spring as it DE-compresses. so therefore, when you add a lowering spring with MUCH higher spring rates (think about the stiffer pen spring) the force exerted by the spring as it DEcompresses is much MUCH higher and since our stock shocks dont do a very good job of limiting the travel of the STOCK springs, when you add lowering springs, the body roll becomes much more pronounced.
Now onto performance shocks/struts. these are filled with oil, and the valves at the end of the shock rods are two way valves which means that the oil travels THROUGH the valve as the shock compresses, which means that a similar force (depending on the valving) must be exerted to DEcompress the shock rod (extend it), which is why if you hand compress a high performance shock, the shock rod will stay down unless you pull it up (which on konis like mine, takes ALOT of force). this is why handling is DRASTICALLY improved with a performance shock/strut, because of the increased force needed to extend the shock rod, the majority of the force exerted as the spring DEcompresses is absorbed. This is why body roll and suspension travel is SIGNIFICANTLY reduced by using a performance shock, hence, increasing the cars handling capabilities.
PS: because of drastic increase of force exerted by a performance spring as it decompresses, the pressure on the STOCK shocks is significantly increased which will cause it to wear out quicker, usually in HALF the time that it normally would. it's not me justifying the $$ i spent on my shocks....it's just a fact, just like if you add 600lbs to your car the brakes will wear out quicker because it takes more work to stop the momentum of the car. hope this helped
07-18-2007, 10:32 PM
#552
Originally Posted by YourNameHere
if your gonna get lower springs. at least get shocks and struts and do it the right way. or just save up and buy coil-overs. ask zack, im sure he regrets not getting coil-over from the start.
Anyone could have copied and pasted a blurb from some website onto scion life scott. but thanks for the effort. you get a gold star.
07-18-2007, 11:06 PM
#554
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if you want another explanation why lowering springs on stock shocks is a bad idea go pick up the copy of Siphon with the the DIY on lowering the xB...it tells it real good
cheap - reliably - performance
you can only have two at a time.
cheap - reliably - performance
you can only have two at a time.
07-18-2007, 11:26 PM
#555
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Hey guys, how's the internet treating everyone today? If you need a link to anything let me know... I reached the end of the internet today and have accumulated a lot of stuff but I can't seem to give it away.
Peace and love, _____es.
Peace and love, _____es.
07-19-2007, 01:43 AM
#556
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I never did get the TRD's... I just blew the ish out of the stock shocks/struts until I couldn't take it anymore, then I got coilovers. If I had to do it all over again, I'd start out with DF210's and TRD Sportivos from the start.
I went with coilovers because I wanted to go lower than where springs would take me.
I won't be raising the car back up in the winter... if it snows, I don't drive. Messing with the ride height screws with the alignment.
I went with coilovers because I wanted to go lower than where springs would take me.
I won't be raising the car back up in the winter... if it snows, I don't drive. Messing with the ride height screws with the alignment.
07-19-2007, 02:26 AM
#557
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Originally Posted by Zillon
I won't be raising the car back up in the winter... if it snows, I don't drive. Messing with the ride height screws with the alignment.
07-19-2007, 04:25 AM
#558
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one thing you guys forget, it dosnt matter if u have 14's or 19's.. if the total wheel diameter (with tire) dose not change.. then the only factor is offset.
if you change the total diameter of the wheel, then you need to think a little more into it.
if you change the total diameter of the wheel, then you need to think a little more into it.
07-19-2007, 04:48 AM
#560
215/35/zr18's are really close to stock wheel diameter.
i'm sure scott will get into specifics about how throwing the spedometer off .01% causes the flux capacator to hit at 89 instead of 88mph.
theres a site out there somewhere with a wheel and tire diameter calculator that will show you the difference between your stock sixe and what tire you're putting on there.
try googling www.miata.net or something like that.
i'm sure scott will get into specifics about how throwing the spedometer off .01% causes the flux capacator to hit at 89 instead of 88mph.
theres a site out there somewhere with a wheel and tire diameter calculator that will show you the difference between your stock sixe and what tire you're putting on there.
try googling www.miata.net or something like that.