allscion

Bon
Allscion -- an e-commerce website with news and accessories for your Scions
http://www.allscion.com/store




http://www.autoweek.com/apps/pbcs.dl...33/1024/indy08

scionlife

Bravo!

draxcaliber

scion doesn't need saving, it just needs some new models.

their cars are great, and i have several things i like about each one, but here is the problem:

front wheel drive, 4 cyl, n/a 5 seater hatchback.

that literally discribes every single scion they have made to this day.

i like hatchbacks, but alot of people, especially in america, don't like them very much, they prefer sedan body styles,and scion doesn't offer one. then, for people who are driving enthusiasts, the tc is pretty much the best they have to offer, but its potential is limited by the front wheel drivetrain.

scion is trying to hit the quirky niche markets, they should consider some of those concepts like the scion pick-up truck. or lightweight sports concept that was rear-wheel drive.

something with all-wheel drive. etc.

jdgriswald

It definitely doesn't need saving by CALTY. That's partly what got them into this mess....trying to dictate "cool" to the American market rather than bringing unique JDM designs to our shores, ala generation 1.

MoScion

The problem is Scion kept asking what can we do better and a few people told them what to do better. The majority of xB owners were happy with their box.

The fact was Scion was doing a lot of things right. For one thing having two 1.5 L fuel efficient vehicles in their line up was right on. The new xB and xD are priced higher than the previous xB and xA models. I’m sorry but if I am going to pay 20k for an xB2 I would rather buy a RAV 4 or pay a little more and get a highlander. That being said I happily paid 19k for the RS3 xB. It is fuel efficient, has a cool noticeable color that I get compliments on it still today two years later. The xB2 is not unique enough for me to want it, and then with the 2.4l which it needs because it is bigger fuel economy goes to hell. I filled up the xB the other day with $35, my tC took about $47 so 12*52= $624 a year that I spend more on gas roughly.

I look at the xB2 and the xD and they look the same almost. I agree a Yaris hatch priced around 12k would fit in nicely in the scion lineup. I don’t know how Scion thinks an 18 year old will be able to afford a 20k vehicle.

Releasing two new product lines together 2/3 or your product line is usually not a good move.

vettereddie

Wow, that guy must have been browsing the Scion Life forums. The overarching themes have been echoing here for over a year now.

1) xA undesold since it was not different enough stock from other small cars and offered less room than the xB for not much price difference.

2) The xB1 made Scion stand out with a Japanese-designed urban vehicle, something conventional wisdom said wouldn't sell in the American market. Even though the tC had more sales, the xB1 was the iconic vehicle of the brand. When they stopped selling it, the brand started to blend back in with Toyota and sales dropped (See what happened to Ford with the Mustang II for history lessons).

3) The tC is not a sports car stock: current and potential Scion owners would love a cheap, RWD or AWD, easy to mod tuner car to be available.

Not sure what their next move will be, you can only do so much in the sub-20k price point. Factory warranted TRD versions of each model in the line-up would be a nice start, as would the xB pickup (El Camino for the rest of us who don't want mullets). Maybe a performance vehicle will finally pop up since Toyota seems to have no plans of bringing back the Celica, Supra, or any performance coupe or sedan. I'm afraid if Toyota follows down their current path, they will become the next Ford a la Taurus when the Camry and Corrola become rental fleet vehicles and Toyota has no other platform to fall back on.

vettereddie

Thanks Mo, I forgot about the RS facts. The first colors were awesome, Hot Lava, Solar Yellow, Envy Green, Blitz Blue, Absolutely Red, even Torched Penny. Then, something happened and they got timid. Stingray Metallic (grey), Blizzard Pearl (white), and Galactic Grey Mica (grey is right in the title!). Shouldn't a RS set itself apart from the standard scheme. I was at the DC auto show, and I swear every single company had the exact same color swatches (white, beige, grey, dark blue, dark red, and black). What happened to Scion's mantra of expression and individualism? Come on, what's really different between Titanium Metallic and Silver Streak Mica besides the paint code numbers? We should have orange, bright red, neon blue, deep violet and other stand-out colors available on standard models.

At least they brought back Hot lava for the xD RS, and no one can accuse them of not standing out with the xB2 RS, even if the paint can look hideous in certain lighting and won't photograph well for squat.

STOCKTOASTER

I THINK AMERICA IS SO FAR BEHIND IN AUTOMOTIVE TECHNOLOGY ALREADY. SO WHEN AN AUTOMOBILE MAKER COMES OUT WITH A CAR LIKE THE XB, I SAY KEEP THEM COMING. I SEE CARS THEY DRIVE OVER SEAS AND I WISH I COULD BUY ONE AND BRING IT HERE. I AM SO SICK AND TIRED OF THE COOKIE CUTTER CARS THAT AUTOMAKERS ARE DISHING OUT JUST SO THEY CAN MAKE $$$$$ AND NOT ROCK THE BOAT AT THE SAME TIME. YET THEY WANT TO BE CUTTING EDGE TO GET PEOPLE TO WANT TO LEAVE THEIR CURRENT VEHICLE FOR A NEW ONE EVEN THOUGH THEIR VEHICLE NOW IS JUST FINE. I HAVE OWNED MANY VEHICLES IN MY LIFE AND THE XB IS THE ONLY ONE THAT MAKES ME FEEL LIKE I DON'T JUST BLEND IN WITH THE CROWD. WHEN I DROVE IT HOME FOR THE FIRST TIME TO MY LITTLE HICK TOWN, NOBODY HAD EVER HEARD OF SCION. FOR ALL I KNOW THEY PROBABLY THOUGHT THEY WERE BEING INVADED BY ALIENS.

SSQ

Even if the scions are not getting sold, it's still making more money than the Fords by sitting in the lot. Because Scion is a brand that's designed for the US market, I would imagine Toyota is right not not paying much attention to it because of where the economy is going in this country.

MoScion

The fact is the 18-25 year olds probably are the best off financially right now. They don’t have a lot of debt yet, they don’t have the depreciating housing market to worry about in most cases. They will need their first car, or need to replace their first car with something a little more reliable. I think they are still the perfect market for Scion’s. For most people who did buy the xA it was because it was a good affordable cheap car. The Yaris hatch is now in that class, but when you load it up it is as much as 17k, and in most cases starts at 13k. The Toyota web site shows MSRP for a manual Yaris hatch around 10k good luck finding that. If there was one in the 10k range they would sell well.

avus

i, for one, applaud Scion for their efforts. it is indeed rare to have a large automaker be so closely involved and active within owner groups. with that, however, there is always room for improvement

the great thing about the original xB was that even with its shortcomings -- slow, loud, etc. -- it still possessed that 'IT' factor. i'm not talking about the hip/cool/underground vibe, but rather it was FUN TO DRIVE. you immediately had a connection with the car. it was the most un-toyotalike Toyota in the States -- and that is what helped define what Scion was/is, not the marketing.

just like BMW owned MINI has its Cooper and Ford owned Mazda has its Miata, Scion had its xB

my main disapproval as an owner of the xB2 is that its not fun to drive. yes, i enjoy the added power, sound insulation, and space -- but the thrill is gone. like the article stated, its now just a Toyota - a "watered-down Corolla." now, the most enjoyable Scion is the xD -- but even it is not as engaging.

will Scion survive? i have no doubt it will. based on concepts and future product models toyota has working, i'm confident Scion will succeed.
i just think Scion is in that junior high school phase -- you know, that awkward tween age where you're not too coordinated and a bit strange looking.

cobb

First off they should give a bit more than 8 grand for a 2 year old model with 13 thousand miles on it for trade for another, but thats another thread.

Here we go, Turn the tc into a sedan, make the xa a 2 door convertible similar to a porsche in design with paddle shifters that gets frekishly high fuel economy and the xb a micro mini pick up truck similar to the vm pick up truck, but thats just me.

Shaka_Z

I believe that scion needs to become more of a no-compromises, maximum bang/$ in the niche brand... stick with the 3-model setup they have now, but set it up as foilows:

1 - Maximum Economy, based around absolute best possible fuel economy, with the lowest possible entry price. this is where models like the xA and xD fit in.

2 - Maximum Utility. this is where the xB fits in, with the niche centered around passenger and cargo capacity, laid out in the most efficient fashion (a box) with fuel economy still important, but not quite so much as the economy model. Price should be in the middle of the range, but not more than what the original xB's went for.

3 - Maximum Performance. this is the home of the tC, although it should be centered around a RWD or AWD, minimum weight, maximum body-style platform. to keep the costs under 20k on this one, it really should be quite obvious that everything went into minimizing weight and maximizing engine, drivetrain and chassis performance. there should be no dealer installed items like radios etc, as it should be expected that anyone who buys this car will install stereo and other systems of their own aftermarket choosing. why pay for an ipod radio when you are just gonna rip it out inside a week for something better? keep the sunroof, but make it something better and lighter than glass, cuz who ever looks up thru the sunroof when it is closed??? screw making it a sedan... I love the hatchback - less drag, and when done right it is inherently a stiffer chassis than a sedan.

then again... just bring back somethng akin to the 2nd gen MR2 and call it a tC and Ill be happy.

CBSIMONSEZ

In a nutshell .. Scion you need to be bold and be daring again. Not drab and like everyone or everything else out there. Take the path less traveled.

FreedomOne

Scion is on the road to world domination!

SciRunner

IMO, these three may save Scion (if priced right).

Daihatsu Copen ZZ(hey looks like a curvy Scion Hako)


Toyota iQ (it already has the Scion two letter naming convention)


Or this
http://www.autobloggreen.com/2007/10...hi-ct-concept/

FreedomOne

What the bloody heck is that thing? It scares me.

ScionEyes

if the gas prices keep going up, i want an iQ ~ the first and third no thank you.. and the third one scares me.

gjpjr84

the copenZ looks NOTHING like what a curvy Haku concept whould probably look like. the haku as it is, is almost completely unrelated to the copenZ. its like comparing a VW beetle to a saturn sky.

the Haku is gonna shake things up more then the xB1 did.

butterfly0fdoom

What I think made Scion awesome (to me, at least) was that, when the Bbx concept was announced, it seems like Toyota was going to use Scion as a marque for quirky JDM cars to appeal to the younger market, as JDM cars that could be priced at under $20k are usually quirky, versatile, and fuel efficient vehicles. But with the new xB, Toyota seems to be Americanizing and de-quirking Scion. Scion could survive as a lineup larger than 3 cars, though, if production is limited to smaller quantities for each car to the point where each car can satisfy its target niche. Something at each price point that targets a different audience.

Out of boredom, I'll just play armchair CEO.

What Toyota could give Scion from their concept vehicle pool:
- the iQ: would work as the most entry-level vehicle for people on a tight budget or people in cramped cities ($12k?)
- the A-BAT: at the high end of the line-up, small urban alternative to compact pickups ($19k?)

What Toyota could give Scion from their JDM pool:
- the Voxy: a boxy wagon with an emergency third row of seats and sliding doors that won't ding other cars in tight parking spaces that could, size-wise and price-wise take the place of the current xB in the lineup ($16k?)
- the Premio /Avensis: a sporty-ish sedan that fits between the Corolla and Camry ($17k?)
- the bB: because Scion doesn't need a boxy version of the Matrix; it could take the xD's place in the line-up, too ($15k?)
- the Porte: to fill in a void that would be left if the xD were to be eliminated, market its quirky extra-large passenger-side door ($13k?)

What Toyota should do with the current Scions:
- the xD: find ways to cut costs while minimizing features removed so that the MSRP can be lowered down to $13-$14k as it already is the stylish version of the Yaris hatch or get rid of it
- the xB: get rid of it and slap the xB badge on the bB
- the tC: replace it with that rumored low-cost RWD/AWD sports coupe