eBox: Scion xB Electric Car Conversion
12-12-2006, 09:10 AM
#1
Founder
SL Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Apr 2003
Location: scionlife.com
Posts: 4,281
eBox: Scion xB Electric Car Conversion
http://www.autobloggreen.com/2006/12...-public-debut/
Originally Posted by AutoBlogGreen
Although a bit pricey, the eBox has an advantage over other electric cars expected to compete in this category: Toyota reputation. The eBox is a Scion xB converted to run on electricity by AC Propulsion. Therefore it has all the amenities offered by Scion and enjoys the reputation of quality and durability from Toyota. Other electric cars coming to market in the $50,000 price range are based on less-known platforms.
The eBox has been seen before in various circles as it was developed. The company's Web site shows a demonstration in Taiwan. But the eBox made its first public appearance at the Alt Car Expo on Saturday. The obvious draws were the spacious interior and funky looks for which the Scion xB is know. "It's a lot of car for the money," said Owen Emry of AC Propulsion.
Another photo, more info and AC Propulsion press release after break.
The xB costs around $15,000, depending on options. The AC Propulsion conversion costs an additional $55,000. Phoenix Motorcars is looking at selling its SUV and SUT for around $45,000 complete, but they're based on the SsangYong vehicles that are made in Korea but unknown here.
The eBox is powered by 635 pounds of lithium ion batteries that are cooled with air from the air conditioning. Range is 140 to 180 miles and top speed is 95 mph. Full charge at normal rate takes five hours. An eBox can be equipped with power windows, cruise control, heater, leather interior, navigation system, power brakes and traction control. AC offers a one-year limited warranty on the conversion and warns that the Toyota warranty on the remainder of the vehicle may not be honored. The company does say all maintenance and repair work can be performed or subcontracted, including pickup and delivery.
Fleet sales where government incentives or mandates may be available are the primary target. If the numbers are strong enough, perhaps the price will come down for mainstream consumers. Also, if the Phoenix vehicles earn strong reviews, then perhaps there will be market pressure on the eBox pricing.
The eBox has been seen before in various circles as it was developed. The company's Web site shows a demonstration in Taiwan. But the eBox made its first public appearance at the Alt Car Expo on Saturday. The obvious draws were the spacious interior and funky looks for which the Scion xB is know. "It's a lot of car for the money," said Owen Emry of AC Propulsion.
Another photo, more info and AC Propulsion press release after break.
The xB costs around $15,000, depending on options. The AC Propulsion conversion costs an additional $55,000. Phoenix Motorcars is looking at selling its SUV and SUT for around $45,000 complete, but they're based on the SsangYong vehicles that are made in Korea but unknown here.
The eBox is powered by 635 pounds of lithium ion batteries that are cooled with air from the air conditioning. Range is 140 to 180 miles and top speed is 95 mph. Full charge at normal rate takes five hours. An eBox can be equipped with power windows, cruise control, heater, leather interior, navigation system, power brakes and traction control. AC offers a one-year limited warranty on the conversion and warns that the Toyota warranty on the remainder of the vehicle may not be honored. The company does say all maintenance and repair work can be performed or subcontracted, including pickup and delivery.
Fleet sales where government incentives or mandates may be available are the primary target. If the numbers are strong enough, perhaps the price will come down for mainstream consumers. Also, if the Phoenix vehicles earn strong reviews, then perhaps there will be market pressure on the eBox pricing.
Originally Posted by AC Propulsion
SANTA MONICA – The eBox from AC Propulsion makes its public debut today at the AltCar Expo in Santa Monica. The eBox is an all electric car – not a hybrid – that uses Li Ion batteries to achieve effortless performance and a range of up to 180 miles, without a drop of petroleum. With the first eBox deliveries scheduled in January, AC Propulsion will pry the lid off the EV coffin – the electric car is not dead after all.
The eBox is a full-function electric car. Whether cruising on a high-speed freeway or slogging through gridlock, the eBox transports its occupants for their daily business in serene comfort, with smooth acceleration, amazing regenerative braking, and informative instrumentation. Recharging is as close as the nearest electric outlet because the eBox can plug in anywhere.
The eBox is a full-function car. It seats five and has one of the roomiest back seats in the business. Fold the rear seat and the eBox takes a huge haul. With air conditioning, power steering, power windows, power mirrors and remote door locks, the eBox matches comfort and convenience with any car.
And it adds one convenience no conventional car can match – refueling at home. Plug it in and it charges while you sleep. In the morning, the tank – a 35 kWh Li Ion battery – is full, with more than enough juice for a typical day's driving. Say goodbye to your friendly neighborhood dealer of petroleum fuels, the eBox never touches the stuff.
The eBox benefits from 15 years of electric vehicle development at AC Propulsion. It represents the state of the electric car art, 2007. AC Propulsion has changed the perception, and the reality, of the electric car with innovations such as light and powerful electric motors, maximized regenerative brakes, integrated high-power chargers, bi-directional grid connections that let the car supply AC power, and high-performance Li Ion traction batteries assembled from commercial cells. This portfolio of innovation has inspired the electric vehicle creations of Venturi Automobile in Monaco, Courrèges Design in Paris, Wrightspeed in Woodside, and Tesla Motors in San Carlos.
The eBox comes with all of these innovations as standard equipment, making it not just a new car, but a signpost for the path toward transportation without petroleum.
AC Propulsion designs, engineers, and manufactures advanced propulsion systems for electric and hybrid vehicles, and provides hardware and engineering services for an international roster of clients. With facilities in San Dimas and Shanghai, AC Propulsion is building technology and capacity to supply electric propulsion systems to electric vehicle manufacturers worldwide.
The eBox is a full-function electric car. Whether cruising on a high-speed freeway or slogging through gridlock, the eBox transports its occupants for their daily business in serene comfort, with smooth acceleration, amazing regenerative braking, and informative instrumentation. Recharging is as close as the nearest electric outlet because the eBox can plug in anywhere.
The eBox is a full-function car. It seats five and has one of the roomiest back seats in the business. Fold the rear seat and the eBox takes a huge haul. With air conditioning, power steering, power windows, power mirrors and remote door locks, the eBox matches comfort and convenience with any car.
And it adds one convenience no conventional car can match – refueling at home. Plug it in and it charges while you sleep. In the morning, the tank – a 35 kWh Li Ion battery – is full, with more than enough juice for a typical day's driving. Say goodbye to your friendly neighborhood dealer of petroleum fuels, the eBox never touches the stuff.
The eBox benefits from 15 years of electric vehicle development at AC Propulsion. It represents the state of the electric car art, 2007. AC Propulsion has changed the perception, and the reality, of the electric car with innovations such as light and powerful electric motors, maximized regenerative brakes, integrated high-power chargers, bi-directional grid connections that let the car supply AC power, and high-performance Li Ion traction batteries assembled from commercial cells. This portfolio of innovation has inspired the electric vehicle creations of Venturi Automobile in Monaco, Courrèges Design in Paris, Wrightspeed in Woodside, and Tesla Motors in San Carlos.
The eBox comes with all of these innovations as standard equipment, making it not just a new car, but a signpost for the path toward transportation without petroleum.
AC Propulsion designs, engineers, and manufactures advanced propulsion systems for electric and hybrid vehicles, and provides hardware and engineering services for an international roster of clients. With facilities in San Dimas and Shanghai, AC Propulsion is building technology and capacity to supply electric propulsion systems to electric vehicle manufacturers worldwide.
12-12-2006, 01:14 PM
#5
Originally Posted by trinben
55,000 dollars. At 3.00/gallon thats 1833 fill ups or 35 years worth of gas I'm not sure if it's worth the cost. 
12-12-2006, 01:18 PM
#6
Senior Member
SL Member
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: WNC
Posts: 761
If anyone spent that much money on a xB, they would have to be mentally ill. Trinben made a good point. The whole Hybrid/Electric Vehicle really wont become mainstream until these car companies actually want to start making this at a reasonable price. The Prius sells extremly well, and so does the civic hybrid. However, the Accord Hybrid, and Camry Hybrid is just not worth the rediculous markup the car companies are charging.
A older guy came into the Tint Shop I work at the other day, and we were chatting about his Prius, then I brought up the point that with the $28k he probably spent (or more), even with the better mileage, he still would of been better off, buying like a 4 cylinder accord or camry and pocket the other 8k. He will never make that up with better gas mileage.
A older guy came into the Tint Shop I work at the other day, and we were chatting about his Prius, then I brought up the point that with the $28k he probably spent (or more), even with the better mileage, he still would of been better off, buying like a 4 cylinder accord or camry and pocket the other 8k. He will never make that up with better gas mileage.
12-12-2006, 01:25 PM
#7
Senior Member
SL Member
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Redneck Riveria
Posts: 2,409
Originally Posted by trinben
55,000 dollars. At 3.00/gallon thats 1833 fill ups or 35 years worth of gas I'm not sure if it's worth the cost.
Lot of unknowns here. For all we know, gas could very well be $30/gal in 5 years.
Sir, if you just sign right here, we'll get you ready for immediate delivery.
12-12-2006, 01:29 PM
#8
Senior Member
Scikotics
SL Member
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Baton Rouge, LA
Posts: 276
Originally Posted by UBOW
Originally Posted by trinben
55,000 dollars. At 3.00/gallon thats 1833 fill ups or 35 years worth of gas I'm not sure if it's worth the cost.
12-12-2006, 01:32 PM
#9
Senior Member
Scikotics
SL Member
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Baton Rouge, LA
Posts: 276
Originally Posted by scionofPCFL
Originally Posted by trinben
55,000 dollars. At 3.00/gallon thats 1833 fill ups or 35 years worth of gas I'm not sure if it's worth the cost.
Lot of unknowns here. For all we know, gas could very well be $30/gal in 5 years.
Sir, if you just sign right here, we'll get you ready for immediate delivery.
12-12-2006, 01:35 PM
#10
Senior Member
SL Member
Join Date: Sep 2005
Posts: 150
The Prius is a step in the right direction. It pretty much says that I wanna save the environment. We should start looking for alternatives. We can't afford to continue making these oil industries richer and richer.
12-12-2006, 02:50 PM
#11
Senior Member
SL Member
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Redneck Riveria
Posts: 2,409
Y'all going about this all wrong.
First state your assumptions:
- Over the next 5 years, gas will average $3.50/gal.
- Over the next 5 years, I'll drive 15,000 miles/year
- During the course of that time, the car I'm currently driving will get 30mpg.
15,000/30 * 3.5 * 5 = $8750 for gas. or, (miles/mpg)(cost)(time) = $
Now, the xB costs 16k. The Electric xB costs 55k + 16k = 71k. 71k - 8750 =62,250
Now, we only have to subsitute 62,250k for $8750 to figure out where it's financially feasable.
For instance, how much would gas have to be to make it worth it?
cost = ($)(mpg)/(miles)(time) or cost = (62.25k)(30)/(15k)(5)
cost = 24.9/gal.
How long would I have to own the car to make it economically viable:
time = (62.25k)(30)/(15k)(3.5)
Time = 35.6 years....if gas averages $3.5/gal over the next 22 years
How many miles per year would I have to drive over the next 5 years to make it feasable?
Miles = (62.25k)(30)/(3.5)(5)
Miles = 107kmi/year. If gas averages $3.5/gal.
This is just simple linear math. If you really wanted to have fun, then you'd take some of the economic projections and plug in some equations instead of variables, and have some fun with Dif-eq. enjoy
Oh, it's totally worth it, I don't see what y'all are complaining about
First state your assumptions:
- Over the next 5 years, gas will average $3.50/gal.
- Over the next 5 years, I'll drive 15,000 miles/year
- During the course of that time, the car I'm currently driving will get 30mpg.
15,000/30 * 3.5 * 5 = $8750 for gas. or, (miles/mpg)(cost)(time) = $
Now, the xB costs 16k. The Electric xB costs 55k + 16k = 71k. 71k - 8750 =62,250
Now, we only have to subsitute 62,250k for $8750 to figure out where it's financially feasable.
For instance, how much would gas have to be to make it worth it?
cost = ($)(mpg)/(miles)(time) or cost = (62.25k)(30)/(15k)(5)
cost = 24.9/gal.
How long would I have to own the car to make it economically viable:
time = (62.25k)(30)/(15k)(3.5)
Time = 35.6 years....if gas averages $3.5/gal over the next 22 years
How many miles per year would I have to drive over the next 5 years to make it feasable?
Miles = (62.25k)(30)/(3.5)(5)
Miles = 107kmi/year. If gas averages $3.5/gal.
This is just simple linear math. If you really wanted to have fun, then you'd take some of the economic projections and plug in some equations instead of variables, and have some fun with Dif-eq. enjoy
Oh, it's totally worth it, I don't see what y'all are complaining about
12-12-2006, 02:58 PM
#13
Senior Member
Scikotics
SL Member
N.G.S.O.
Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: smarthomes chattanooga TN
Posts: 459
Typically, the fuel savings AREN'T there in order to justify the pricing of hybrids or electrics. Where they DO excel, however, is in environmental impact, or lack thereof. Economy will come in time, but the environmental benefits are tough to ignore. More car companies should be so concerned about the air.
12-12-2006, 03:29 PM
#15
Senior Member
SL Member
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Raleigh, NC
Posts: 818
$70k for an xB?
The price is so mindnumbingly outrageous, that unless you are a rich member of Greenpeace, or a Connecticut democrat, there is no way that this can even be viewed as progress.
It is so completely off the wall, that I can only assume it's a joke. Ha ha. Thank you Toyota! Best one I've heard today! In the future, please note one of two things:
1) Money really does NOT grow on trees in America.
or
2) We celebrate April Fools Day... in April.
The price is so mindnumbingly outrageous, that unless you are a rich member of Greenpeace, or a Connecticut democrat, there is no way that this can even be viewed as progress.
It is so completely off the wall, that I can only assume it's a joke. Ha ha. Thank you Toyota! Best one I've heard today! In the future, please note one of two things:
1) Money really does NOT grow on trees in America.
or
2) We celebrate April Fools Day... in April.
12-12-2006, 03:38 PM
#17
Senior Member
SL Member
Scion Evolution
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: San Diego, CA
Posts: 340
I agree, the price isn't something the average person (or even someone with a bit of money to blow) would drop on converting their car to 100% electric. But the point of being able to do this is to show that there's a market out there for it. There are people who want an eBox, and a very small amount are willing to put the time and money into it to show it can be done.
Even if I could afford an eBox, I wouldn't buy it. But if I had the know-how and parts/time/money to do it myself, I'd love to try building it. And 10 years down the road, my efforts would probably be viewed as pioneering.
Even if I could afford an eBox, I wouldn't buy it. But if I had the know-how and parts/time/money to do it myself, I'd love to try building it. And 10 years down the road, my efforts would probably be viewed as pioneering.
12-12-2006, 03:42 PM
#18
Senior Member
SL Member
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Somewhere, USA
Posts: 684
$55000 divided by $3/gal is 18333 gallons, not tanks.
If my fuel-up is typically 10 gallons, then it was right the first time at 1833 tanks.
In my own case, that would be enough for 76 years of gasoline, assuming gas remains at $3/galllon for the next 76 years. Yeah right.
I'd rather have a plug-in hybrid.
If my fuel-up is typically 10 gallons, then it was right the first time at 1833 tanks.
In my own case, that would be enough for 76 years of gasoline, assuming gas remains at $3/galllon for the next 76 years. Yeah right.
I'd rather have a plug-in hybrid.
12-12-2006, 03:43 PM
#19
Senior Member
SL Member
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: CT
Posts: 249
yea, that is a good point.
not practical just yet, that's for sure.
when I went to Bermuda the biggest engine in a car was a BMW w/ a 2.2liter engine.... 2sumtin was the model, ooh and ofcourse steering wheel on the other side ;p
mostly people would drive scooters cuz they don't burn gas for $hit.
a VW polo w/ a 1.4L was something to be exciteds about.
If we all drove 4cyl we'd be better off
not practical just yet, that's for sure.
when I went to Bermuda the biggest engine in a car was a BMW w/ a 2.2liter engine.... 2sumtin was the model, ooh and ofcourse steering wheel on the other side ;p
mostly people would drive scooters cuz they don't burn gas for $hit.
a VW polo w/ a 1.4L was something to be exciteds about.
If we all drove 4cyl
we'd be better off
12-12-2006, 06:04 PM
#20
Senior Member
SL Member
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: WNC
Posts: 761
Originally Posted by JUMBO
Typically, the fuel savings AREN'T there in order to justify the pricing of hybrids or electrics. Where they DO excel, however, is in environmental impact, or lack thereof. Economy will come in time, but the environmental benefits are tough to ignore. More car companies should be so concerned about the air.
Sure, then you can argue: "But we are running out of fossil fuels, we need to switch to a different energy source, were running out of oil"....