The new xB is about 100 lbs heavier than the tC, but it returns BETTER mileage. The problem is that starting with 2008, the EPA changed the testing procedures for fuel mileage, so all 2008 models will get lower, more realistic ratings.

Using the official calculator on the EPA website, the 2006 xB would have gotten 26/30 in the 2008 tests, and the 2007 tC would get 20/28. The new xB manages 22/28 in the 2008 ratings. To compare these numbers with the numbers you are used to, (2007 and earlier EPA ratings) the 2008 xB would have gotten 25/31 in the 2007 test.

 

Having seen a xB2 on the Freeway about 10 days ago on a stop and go traffic, I think it is good looking. However, I wish Toyota continued offer smaller box, real box, with 1.5 liter or 1.8 liter (max) as well. I know there are Yaris and Honda Fit but with this gas price at $3.42/gallon here in L.A, I rather have my box (classic) that has better MPG than xB2.

 

i'd have to agree, my "bad" thoughts towards the the xB2 is mainly toward it's "appearing" performance *being i havn't test driven one my self yet*. but the mileage is what is nastey... prices here are about 3.35 a gallon right now i think *been about 2 weeks since the last fill*, i'm going to be filling with premium only from now on to get use to using it do to future plans of using a turbo and whatnot.

i really think toyota should come out with a bio-diesle ready engine thats just about the same in performance ratings as the current 1NZFE that way theres better mileage and for tuners, better mileage and performance gains at the same time. and or come out with hybrid conversions for customers to come back and change over when they are ready. that would be the best thing toyota could ever do i think.

 

I as well will withhold most judgments until after I drive one and do some measurements..
my focus will be on the needs of the graying generation. ie;
ease of ingress / egress, seating, head and leg room, dash module positions (think tri-focals) , and parking, visibility & blind spots (if any).
red

 

Hey Bigfieroman,

I've heard you mention these numbers several times but I've noticed no one else has confirmed this. How sure are you that the 2008xb would tranlate to 25/31 in 2007? How did you figure this out.. what's the formula? Is there any site that converts milage from 2007 to 2008 and vice versa?

 

Check it out for yourself from the EPA's website http://www.fueleconomy.gov/feg/ratings2008.shtml Look at the links for the conversion calculators at the bottom of the page.
Remember you have to choose the 2006 xB as there was no 2007 xB and you can confirm what Bigfieroman was saying.

 

Thanks bkirby.

Basically what he said. I use this calculator:

http://www.fueleconomy.gov/feg/calculator.html

Inputting 30/33 for the gen 1 yields 26/30, automatic is 30/34--->26/31.

Inputting 25/31 for the gen 2 yields 22/28.

It is kind of funny, really. If you go through all these old threads, there are all of these haters claiming the new xB will weigh 3300 lbs or something, then the weight came out and they "disappeared" (though, in my opinion, it is still too heavy by ~200-300 lbs).

Before the price came out, LOTS of negative people were speculating at a $17k base, $18k base, some predicting close to $20k. Heck, even I was guessing $16-17k base, Scion surprised us all. About $1600 more than the old one shut most people up, but every once in a while, someone will come out complaining about the price, saying it is not as good a value...unfortunately for them it is tough to argue with numbers.

The mileage was the the worst one though, people were predicting up to 10 mpg less city than the first gen (aka, 16 mpg 2008 rating). Now that the mileage is out, they all seem to either be ignorant of the new 2008 EPA ratings (understandable), or feigning ignorance in an attempt to make the car look bad. I have argued with more than one person who is incredibly obtuse and focused on making the new xB look like an H2. They argue that their old xB gets 32 in the city day-to-day, and the new xB is rated 22, so it is a 10 mpg difference. They refuse to acknowledge that them driving their cars on their routes with their payloads, etc, have no bearing on the EPA ratings. The EPA ratings do not correspond well to real world numbers because of all the variables. The main benefit of the EPA numbers is that you can compare 2 cars. The old xB and new xB get 22 and 26 city, respectively. That means, if your old xB is getting 32 on your route, etc, the new one will probably get about 4-5mpg less. Tha only way you will get significantly lower mileage is if you are a leadfoot. Mileage will drop significantly in both cars; just moreso on the new xB because it weighs more, and its engine is simply capable of drinking way more fuel. If you really drive it like you stole it EVERYWHERE, as in, treating the throttle like an on-off switch, you would get maybe 24 in the old xB but ~15 in the new one.


/soapbox


If you are really bored and want to read a pre-mileage announcement argument, check out this thread:
https://www.scionlife.com/forums/vie...r=asc&&start=0
It is between me and grtwhtcube, and gets going on page 2.

 

http://www.fueleconomy.gov/feg/calcu...umn=1&id=19901

2004 xB Auto

New EPA MPG
City 26
Combined 28
Hwy 31

Old EPA MPG
City 30
Combined 32
Hwy 34

 

Okay so I agree that on average there is a 3mpg difference since:

old xb (auto): (26 + 30) / 2 = 28
new xb (auto): (22 + 2 / 2 = 25

What you said about "lead footing" it is interesting because to me it seems like I'd be more inclined to lead food the old xb to get enough power rather than the new one which would probably just get me a ticket due to the massive power increase. Since I don't like tickets, and usually don't have traffic problems, I think the difference should be even less than 3mpg.

It's too bad that the changes to EPA is not common knowledge because I noticed on the Honda Element thread that they were comparing the new xb mpg to the old element mpg and concluded that the mpg is about the same for both vehicles (with the xb only 1mpg ahead) when the reality is that the new xb milage is quite a bit better.

 

I realize one is more likely to leadfoot the old xB, and if drove it, it would be floored all the time.

My comparison was if you leadfooted both...nevermind you would be doing 30 mph more in the new xB

 

Amen, brother! Scion completely lost me as a customer. Why do auto companies consistently destroy light, fun cars by growing them fat and ugly? Why???!

 

Well, I got to drive a new xB today. I must say, i was rather pleased by acceleration and all that. Cosmetically, it was nice too. Loved it!

 

Because they listen to the complainers/haters of the xb and not the owners. their marketing strategy is basically - we already have the money of current scion xB owners. lets get the money of non-xb owners and give them what they want . that, in term, means to listen to the "complaints" and set those changes forth in the newer model.

it's too boxy, it's too slow, it's too small, etc are common complaints which have been "addressed" in the gen 2 xB - to the relief of the haters and the disbelief of current owners. i think only time will tell how well the gen 2 will do in sales compared to the gen 1.
- sh00k

 

eeeeeeeeeeaaaaaaaaasssssssssssyy buddy. 1st gen xB, tC, ok. I can see that. But Civic Si and WRX?

Serious question though - how does it feel compared to a tC? It looks like it is even more top heavy and has a twist beam in back.

 

Remember, although the new xB is considerably taller than the tC, the center of gravity won't be that much higher because the massive, heavy, glass roof of the tC gives the tC a higher center than its overall height would suggest.

 

I have two '05 xB's with one used 120-150 miles a day for business and my wife driving the other. Both are OE aspirated/stock with the 5-spd stick. We replaced the stock plugs at 12K on both with Bosch Platinum +4, but everything else is still OE. The business one just turned 70,000 miles and the wife's grocery-getter is at about 26,000.

The 2005 xB window-stickers said EPA estimated Cty34/35Hwy MPG. We run 93 octane BP gas and Mobil1 5w30 in the crankcase. I carry my 240lb butt and about another 800lbs in tools and repair service parts in mine. I drive a combination of 50/50% city/hwy driving (commuter+house-to-house type). I turn off the track control and floor it off of every stoplight even hitting 80-90mph on some of the country backroads on the way home.

Since that xB is used for business, I keep an extensive mileage and fuel consumption log. I have never gotten less than 32 actual miles per gallon (average) from my gen1 xB.
My wife keeps a tight household budget and the fuel economy was the reason she opted out of a $42,000 Toyota Solara convertible (yep we were in the showroom trying to close the deal Yeah, I would have made the payments but the gas would have come out of the grocery budget so she would have none of it ).

She is always very moderate in her driving habits and records her mileage in the checkbook wt each fill-up. She has managed figures of 36+ mpg with her teenager shuttle-service, grocery-trips, shopping, and social visits. (I say "moderate" because she doesn't qualify for "little blue-haired old lady peering over the dash status" yet but, if we meet for lunch during a work day in respectively separate xB's, she always lags way behind when following me home!)

My son has just bought the 2007 TC with the 2.4l and A/T... he's making those $400 payments so I hear gas-money is tight (at any mpg) but I haven't heard how his real-world figures are stacking-up. The new xB is a touch heavier and not quite as aero as the TC, so I would think the mileage estimates should be slightly lower than a current TC. TC owners could weigh in on how much 'actual mileage may vary' and give a better idea what could be expected from the gen2 xB compared to the EPA estimates.

In any case, I don't know what all the buzz is with the 'revamped' EPA ratings but the two xB's we have aren't off from the old 2005 figures at all. So far I have managed to laugh off the $3+ premium prices

Maybe the Gen2 figures will actually be overall better average MPG's than the 'new' EPA ratings suggest.

Wishful thinking?

 

I drove one today...

Well, the acceleration is decent, although it wasn't as quick as I was expecting. I found the handling to be a bit sloppy. It needs a swaybar. I did like the ride though, considerably smoother than the current box.

I'm not going to run out and trade in, but it's decent.

 

I felt the new xB to be a little TOO soft while in the drivers seat. Seats were like couches, riode like a Cadillac and steering was about as effective as a Tahoe. I like a little feedback when I'm drivin a car cuz I'm a driver. Didn't know what the car was doing. I was thinkin when driving that all these things I didn't like are the things that people here complained about with their xB's. Too stiff a suspension, seat are too hard blah blah blah. well there you have it, You got a four banger Tahoe now. Sorry.

Edit: not complaining about the car. I prolly won't buy one. Just the observances I had while cruising one. But I really didn't like that feeling of being disconnected form the car while turning and going over bumps. But that's what happens to people that drive cars with a performance inspired suspensions on their daily driver.

 

..i was impressed with the '08 xB .
..drove both auto & manual .
..a couple mods would turn it into a tight performer .
..alot more car ; room , comfort , performance & safety .
.. this unit will appeal to rav4 , 4cyl,highlander and young family camry buyers , as well as our scion folks .
..supply will be tight & demand heavy.
.. the teal looked better than i thought it would .
.. hope all RS models get colorful paints , wheels & roof ., instead of a bunch of silly mods .

 

I second that color thing. I'm not impressed with the color choices. Very bland at best.