scionlife

Entire article about GM is located here:
http://www.forbes.com/2006/05/15/gm-...0516flint.html

GooseNaBoxxx

Can this article specify itself any more in plain english?? I mean come on, Im no CEO and I get it! I have seen the insides of the new GM vehicles. They are pretty nice, but lets face it, we live in a society where aethetics matter more. And lets face it, GM is making plain cars and trucks with poor numbers. From the outside, they are unappealing, even if the extras are nice. I think most american made cars need to stop jerking its people around and make good on its promises.

scionlife

Well stated!

scionofPCFL

If the folks at GM "got it", they would not have to have that article read to them.

dskinner

To bad GM can't afford to "get it"

JUMBO

The Prius cost Toyota HUGE $$ for the first 4 years (1997-2001). Didn't make a penny. Tons of $$ was poured into R&D and production to make it feasible and reliable, and now Toyota is reaping the benfits. We are selling more hybrids than ANYONE, and even other manufacturers are buying our technology (Nissan, Ford, Porsche). So we get more R&D FOR FREE. Awesome.

While it makes sense for GM to follow the advice in the column, this SHOULD have happened nearly a decade ago. Once again, GM has let technology pass it by, and is perpetually playing catch-up.

Killa

Hybrids are just a fad... in 15 years or so as the hybrids are fading away, people are just starting to wonder "what was everyone thinking?"
Cost more per unit... cost more per unit to produce... cost more to design... relatively short life span of the vehicle, unless you want to pay more to maintain them and keep them.
I can't wait for newer, smaller, quieter diesel engines to gain favor in the US as they have in europe...
I can't wait until the world runs out of petrolium though (because it's the huge petrolium producers that are paying to hold up new developements in energy producing technology)... I'd like to see some type of technology embrassed, other than the internal combustion engine..... but hybrids are NOT the answer.

hodad66

Killa, I'm with you. I loved my VW Golf TDI. But my big dream is when we drop oil completely. Let the middle east slip back into obscurity. Take away all those dollars that are funding terrorism.

Give me an "air car" or hydrogen or something. From a national security viewpoint.... stepping away from petroleum should have been our biggest goal since the hostage crisis & oil crunch in the 70's.

Of course that couldn't happen because the vested interests in this country want to squeeze the last cent from their dirty, polluting, oil interests...

J_Bomb

That is the answer right there. ^^^ It has the most explosive power and no harmful emissions. I hope oil runs out soon and I also hope gas prices keep going up. If GM wants to take the lead then they better start researching hydrogen.

Boxer_Rebellion

Emphasis on the word "explosive", haha. Seriously tho-

Obviously the major manufacturers as well as petroleum corporations have been able to keep alternative technologies down for decades now. It's only when customers stop buying huge inefficient vehicles and there's a big enough shift in the market towards hybrids and diesels, that the U.S. companies will have no choice but put serious development into new technology. We need to "vote with our pocketbooks."

Even then, it's hard to imagine them catching up to the Japanese and Germans.

In this age of ever-increasing globalization, however, I wouldn't doubt that in a few decades that hybrid and more exotic powertrains will be able to be plugged into multiple platforms from different companies...

JUMBO

Killa: no offense, but you must be high.

I'm not sure where you are getting your data, but Toyota's production history is showing the exact opposite of what you claim. The new Hybrid Camry costs as much as the current gas-only Camry XLE, and Toyota has shown that the Hybrid powertrain in the current generation Prius can go beyond 180,000 miles with no issues. Plus, at this point, if you should go beyond the Hybird warranty in your ownership (8 year/100,000 miles), a new battery pack costs only $2300 at this point. In two years, that will be HALF that. And since the internal combustion engine is under less strain when it is an Atkinson cycle, it will last longer, too.

I hate to tell you, but Hybrids are here to stay. The ONLY difference will be the source of the other propulsion, be it diesel fuel (locomotives) or hydrogen, which is WAY OFF considering that hydrogen cars are currently being built by men in white coats and there is NO infrastructure to distibute it safely and cost effectively. And until we can separate the hydrogen out of water on the fly in car, an infrastructure is what we need.

I hate to say it, but Toyota is going in the right direction on this one, too.

uberscionofglendale

i read somewhere that while hydrogen doesn't emit any harmful substances when it's used as fuel, creating the fuel cell creates (in the end) more pollution that a gas engine. don't know how true that is, but that's kind of interesting if it is.
hybrids are great, but i would love to see a different type of fuel as well, i hate how we're so dependant on oil.

spectra_blue

This is basically GM's last meal before its execution... They've sunk themselves so low now that they have to resort to using popular ideas to bring their sales back up. 6 years ago, when Toyota brought out the Hybrid line of Prius's to their line-up, it was only the beginning of a major revelation for them. Everyone was doubting the success, but today, Toyota, dropping two lines of cars and adding 2 more, the addition of a subsidiary company, redesigning their models, and adding 2 more hybrids, Toyota is kicking ___ and taking names. All because they decided to go with the gas mileage rather than big engines in their vehicles. Also, they base their production off of the previous year's numbers, so they know what will sell and how much to produce...

What are GM and Ford doing? 6 years ago, they had gas guzzling cars, trucks, and SUVs. They thought bigger was better. They thought wrong... Now, they are paying for it and they only way to salvage what little is left is to try what is working. This is their last cry for help and I think it's far little too late for GM in this battle. Toyota will only create better models and will always have a jump on the competition and the only thing the competition can do is try and keep up.

2xB

I think we need to do alot more than make more fuel efficent cars to reduce our dependance on oil. This is another reason I don't care for the media. Just like on other issues, they take an extreme, alarmist stance. "Your toothbrush could KILL YOU!!, film at eleven" Then you wantch and find out that some girl dropped her toothbrush on the floor behind the toilet and mom and dad hadn't cleaned the bathroom in 3 months and she got some rare infection....you know.

We don't know how much oil there is on the planet. We have alot more exploring to do, and there are other oil sources that we are aware of that we haven't tapped in to yet (and I'm not talking about reserves or Alaska). Just in what we know and not tapping into any other known methods of extraction, we have enough to go another 40 years, even at the rate we consume it right now. I hate gas prices as much as anyone, but blaming certain automobile manufaturers, or people who choose not to drive small/more fuel efficient cars, isn't the answer, IMHO. Even people who drive a Prius are still fueling our dependace on oil. They only reduce the amount of gasoline they use. Don't get me wrong, it's still a step in the right direction.

It's funny, the same environmentalists, etc.. that protested the creation of new refineries years ago because they are worried about the environment, are protesting now because gas in too expensive. We haven't built a new oil refinery in 40 years. We need more of them if we want lower gas prices, and the big oil companies need to use all these big profits to invest in exploration, more ways to extract/gather oil, and additional refineries.

Gasoline and diesel are only part of why this country is so dependant on crude oil. Even if you had a car that ran on air...it takes oil to manufacture it. It takes oil to luburcate all it's parts. It takes oil to make the asphalt you may drive/park it on, protectants and waxes you put on/in it, your tires. It took oil to make the plastic and rubber parts of your PC, cell phone, TV, cable box, stereo etc. The roof on your house, the makeup your wife/girlfriend wears, the fluid in your cigarette/fireplace/grill lighter, the lighters themselves...more oil.

I don't work for the oil industry...I'm in IT.

/incoherent rambling off ...hehe

jefferino

Sad part of that all is that GM has had the technology and ability for a long time to do this. They also worked with Toyota on it a long time back but oh well they aren't that smart and Toyota obviously is.

R2D2

Hybrid is here to stay. Whether gas/electric hybrid is going to stay I highly doubt it, however Hybrid is a mix of technologies, therefore Hydrogen/Electric Hybrid is what I predict will be around for atleast the next 50 years from when it enters the mainstream.
Incase da blind/ignorant didn't realize, we are & continue to kill ourselves (aka Mother Earth). Listening to the niave's propoganda (aka bushwhacker) that "...there is no evidence of global warming..." is completely preposterous.
Now, as we Industrialize ourselves into oblivion all we think about are gas prices... Seriously, You really think gas prices will really matter when we figure out our Ozone layer is gone and too late to correct it??? Think about it. I doubt they make an SPF high enough to block out a sun without The Ozone, however u'd be saving on gas prices... Oh, on top of all that our ice caps that are "...slowly..." melting would be melting a LOT faster. Water World here we come!
Toyota you'd better start R&D in some Hydrogen/electric boats.

evilBOXevil

COOL!!! Can I be the mariner this time? Kevin Costner sucked, but I could probably be pretty cool at it. This might work out allright...

I'll be back. I'm gonna go burn some garbage outside my apartment!!! Die ozone die!! Waterworld!! Yeah!!! [/quote]

R2D2

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