I'm surprised no ones already said this but its probably because of the number of cars already out there that are bringing down the sales. Hit up your local craigslist and chances are you could find a smoking deal on a used scion from a private party. Of course this kind of availability wasn't available the early years of scion & sales at dealerships were rocking. Scions is a niche market and its been saturated. Its losing the market to itself.

 

the Lexus numbers are down too btw

 

Also when scion first came out there cars were pretty unique over in the states..but the consumer has so many new options now that perform just as well, if not better than scions do..and I don't necessarily mean power or handling, things like capacity and mpg are factors as well. Now you have cars like the soul, cube, forte coupe, fiesta, fit and so on out there that kind of have that look that a lot of people got scions for in the first place.

As for Lexus - Toyota in general needs to win back public trust and Lexus just hasn't done anything new in a while and are falling behind..all the other luxury companies have releases newer, better, more competitively priced vehicles.

 

Yes all car sales are down. . . but it's funny how luxury cars (like Lexus) still manage to sell better than no-frills basic cars (like Scions). Technically if the economy was that bad (as many of you are saying), then opposite would be true, and luxury cars would be hit MUCH harder. Less people are buying cars, yes. But Scions have had bad sales for quite a while. And because Lexus' are not hit proportionately harder than Scions, it can be argued that the primary driving factor is NOT economic conditions, but the products/company/brand.

It's easy to dismiss things and blame the economy, but you know what? Good businesses that thrive do so not by blaming conditions and doing nothing, but rather they succeed by adapting to (ever and always) changing conditions.

And as for Lexus, all luxury makes tend to have long life cycles, as development costs are high. BMW is very good at doing subtle refreshes and updates though. The GS is pretty much at the end of it's life cycle, however the LS and the IS still have some ways to go before a new model is released. The HS is a joke, and the ES (bread, butter, and volume seller) and subsequent cousin RX will see a redesign as soon as the new Camry drops, which shouldn't be long either, but due to recent financial constraints, I could see them holding off just slightly longer on the Camry platform update.

 

Just checked on something today to satisfy my curiosity, and I think I may have another small reason that Scion sales (at least the xB2/xD) are down: Fierce competition.

Kia Soul with their 2.0L engine, automatic, 100,000 mile warranty, side air bags, fancy alloy wheels, low profile tires, fancy sound system with subwoofer, external amp, and satellite, carpet floor mats, cargo liner, bluetooth, audio controls, and cruise control on the steering wheel and all the usual other little extras out-the-door for under $5900 with Vanilla as a trade-in. All that with 0.0% financing

That's actually a Hell of a bargain (even tempting), especially since Scion no longer has something in that niche.

Bottom line is it's a deal that Scion can't match, and that Kia is pushing hard at.

Besides the Hamsters are cute and catch people's attention...

 

(I'd guess that is also in part why Kia has sold over 22,000 Souls so far this year, and the only Scion of a similar size has sold less than 4000...

http://www.subcompactculture.com/201...act-sales.html

 

Well I guess I'll chime in here. I may be 21, but I've been in the Scion game since I was 15. Family is on our 3rd Scion.

Scion has taken a huge dive IMO. They have never been as strong as they were in years 2-4. The intro of the xB2 under the "xB" nameplate was a major fail. They tried to ride the coattails xB classic with something that was nothing like it. I like the xB2, as another vehicle, not as an xB. The xB2 is great for families and such, but is no where near the UUV the xB Classic was. It was especially salty back when the xB2 was introduced. People that have been here a while know. The xB and xA nameplate were supposed to be dropped for new names and new rides. xA: Check. xB: Fail. Would have been fine if the brought over the 3rd gen bB or stuck to a small, funky, utilitarian, platform.

I am right with Tomas, if we had the 3rd gen bB with the Dex front end (HOT FIYAH).

The xA to xD transition seemed close, but not on point. They could have done better.

The tC being out for 12,000 years is Toyota milking the cow for as long as they could. Dumb, but I understand why they did it. They needed to kill it earlier, but the climate at the time, I understand.

Their lack of focus on the owners (compared to the beginning) is understandable. The current climate makes it really difficult to spend all that dough, but they still try.

Scion will be hurting for a while. As much as I love the iQ, I don't see it selling as the xB Classic did for Scion's inception. I just can't see a sharp increase for Scion coming anytime soon.

I still don't see why Scion left a segment they did so much to advance. Why they went with bloated, big, and cars that blend in, I'll never understand. They needed to stay with small, useful, and funky/fun cars. They should have stayed with things that worked extremely well for them but they didn't. They listened to "prospective customers" rather than those that would "actually buy." I get comments all the time from people that tell me they would buy an xB Classic on the spot if they were still produced new. Or something like it. I know for a fact my pops would buy an xB Classic if they were still produced new (Folks are wary of buying used, don't ask me why).

 

you have touched on a key component here and that is value... the Scion product is a great value any more...they lost the value savvy affluent customer which bought into their products early on....I can afford much more expensive cars than I buy however I always buy on value so the Scion originally attracted me....look who was buying it mostly at the onset of the brand being introduced...the blue hairs were all over it.

 

Actually that is incorrect. . . the tC has had THE youngest median buyer age of any car in the market, but the new xB and xD have been dragging that median age up for the entire brand.

 

umm no ur wrong here it may have BUT the median age way off what they expected and when only the younger buyers were left behind......

 

posting links on a phone browser is tough so I suggest a search, tons of sources online can verify that fact for the tC. If ur saying they didn't acheive what they wanted, that's a different and possibly valid point. But the tC undeniably had THE youngest median buyer age of any car for its time. That would suggest that it's not the "geezers" buying them. Gut feel and impressions don't hold a candle to statistics. When I get to my work tomorrow in about 8 hours, I'll post links for you.

 

Scions, more so the tC, may have a lower median driver age but most buyers tend to be older adults. Usually their parents. I see more older couples an people in xB's and xD's than youngin's.

 

I know I saw it somewhere, can't find it, but the tC is the youngest driven vehicle in the country. The median age was like 26-28. I tried finding the article, but I can't find it anymore.

Anyone blaming the economy, is blatantly retarded. It's essentially like this...
Person A : Scion sales are significantly down.
Person B : DERP ECONOMY DERP
Person A : Nissan and Kia sales are significantly up.
Person B logs out and never returns.

 

I just built a Soul + and an xD as equally as possible. Basically, the Soul+ had no extra options, the xD I had to add the armrest, handsfree, and 16's, since they're all standard on the Soul.

The xD:

Base MSRP $14,900
Del, Proc & Handling $670
Accessories $1,249
Grand Total $16,819


The Soul+:
Invoice - $14,590
Delivery - $695
Total - $15,285

$1500 more for the xD, and that's not even matching the warranty. To get a 10/100,000 warranty from Toyota, it's probably another $2,000. I'm going based off Subaru's pricing, as their best extended warranty is right around the $2,000 mark, and the 5/60 I bought for my WRX was actually less than the 5/60 I bought for my tC.

I could have left the xD with no options, and it STILL would be more expensive than the Soul, which offers more features and a better warranty.

So essentially, to equip the Soul+ and xD, it's roughly $3-4,000 more for the xD. That's why Scion sales are plummeting.

 

I'm can't find any stats on median driver age, but you are right that the stats do not account and distinguish between purchaser and user.

 

OK, couldn't wait so I jumped on my computer to fix the blatant misinformation going around. . .

Here are FIVE sources stating the tC as THE youngest median buyer (yes buyer, not driver) age:
http://www.mediapost.com/publication...art_aid=128798
http://www.motortrend.com/roadtests/..._xb/index.html
http://www.allbusiness.com/automotiv...9393902-1.html
http://www.toyoland.com/scion/scion-2005.html
http://www.egmcartech.com/2010/04/01...in-early-2011/
And now it seems sales have taken a nose dive and median buyer age is skyrocketing. Hmmmm, whatever they were doing in the beginning, supposedly attracting those imaginary blue hairs, was working? I don't know.

But if you don't know anything about how stats work, if this model has the youngest median, it means that people who are younger than the data set simply are not in the market to buy a new car. If younger people are flocking to another model, it would skew the numbers, thus the tC would not have become the best seller for that demographic. If they were shooting to get buyers who were 5 years old, then they'd just be retarded. Because of the baby boomers out there, they will always any stat, thus who ever holds the lowest average and median will own the market. Their mission was to get the youngest buyers out there, and they acheived it (back when the original models were around). I don't think there is any way to force 5-year-olds to buy cars. . .

Oh yes, "derp derp economy derp derp." Sounds like half the posts I see defending poor sales of poor products. VERY well put. You made my day with that post.

 

I'd be willing to bet a large amount, that if you took a focus group and had them choose between the Soul and the xD (removing the logos and badges from the cars), the Soul would win in a landslide. It is my opinion that it is an infinitely better car. What Kia (parent company Hyundai) basically did, as they always have done in the past, was copy from success. Kia copied everything that was just sooo right about the xB1 and put it into the Soul. Scion decided to have "Montezuma's Revenge" all over the xB and re-released it as something completely different and unrelated. Nobody wants it and very few people are buying it.

Toyota (and other popular makes) have historically outsold the Koreans because they can afford to charge a premium for the reputation of reliability (whether or not they are better is besides the point). The fact that Mercedes and BMW cost significantly more than Lexus, does not mean that nobody buys BMW or Mercedes. However if you look at Lexus history, as sales went up, the price difference got smaller. Right now Kia and Hyundai have low prices because they have no choice. But once sales go up, expect the same thing to happen.

When Lexus first came out, the Lexus LS400 was $30k and a comparable Benz or BMW was at least $50k. Today, the top of the line LF-A costs well over $300k and a fully loaded LS600hL will nearly cost $100k.

 

If you isolate the TC yes, bu remember it was late to the game

 

That's what he was saying all along, the tC was the youngest driven vehicle, not the Scion brand. The xB was a complete failure in terms of who bought it. They advertised it to the 18-25 market, it ended up having one of the oldest demographics on the market. It still sold, but not to who they planned on selling it to.

 

Actually the xB classic sold best to two groups, the young folks wanting an odd looking vehicle (something their parents hated instantly) that was practical yet easily customizable, durable, and inexpensive for what one got. The box their parents called ugly at the first glimpse was the perfect choice.

The other group it sold very well to was the old farts like me who saw the perfect City Car: Small footprint, amazing room inside, easiest car on the US market to get in and out of, efficient, excellent visibility, and again, inexpensive for what one got.

Eventually BOTH groups (and the third group, the commercial box people - florist delivery, customer courtesy cars, delivery, etc.) found that not only was the box inexpensive in first cost, but was one of the most reliable and cheapest to maintain vehicles in ANY market.

Then the Toyota US designers got involved and made an American version as the xB2 - longer, lower, wider, heavier, bigger engine, smoother aerodynamic lines, etc.

Oops. Great car but it tended to miss the mark - even the young person's parents liked it. It looked like it belonged. It wasn't quirky. It was much more refined, much more integrated into the flow of all the rest of the cars on American roads. It didn't excite those wanting something different in the same way the original did.

(I actually fit into a small subset of all the above: When I first saw the middle of a Scion commercial on Adult Swim while clicking by the channel, I saw this quirky looking little gray Tokyo City Car buzzing down an urban street and turning away from the camera and decided right then I wanted one. Didn't know who made it, didn't care. It would be mine. That was late 2004, and I bought Vanilla in January 2005. So I may be in the "Old Fart" contingent, but I bought the car because it was "different" in a way I liked. The design didn't speak to me, it SANG!)

Now I may be replacing it. I'd love to replace it with what is currently being sold around the world as the bB, COO, Materia, and DEX, because of much desired detail improvements like side airbags, but Toyota has chosen not to include the United States in that particular world wide market. There are very limited choices in the UUV market in the US, and none of them are made by Toyota (and the closest to the original xB Classic, the Nissan Cube, is overpriced and weird in ways that don't appeal for some reason - things like a dash with a toupee...).



I really don't want to leave the Scion (or even Toyota) family, but...