rickbreitenfeldt

One of my friends over in Oakwood was shoved off the road in the fog by some @$$hole in a big SUV coming the other way about the first of March. His tC went into the ditch on the side of the road and caught a culvert and flipped it end over end then when it hit the field, it kicked out side ways and rolled side to side for 2 rotations. The side bags went off. He was bruised and had a broken jaw. This tC is tough. He was going 55 on the two lane when it happened. It was crushed around him but it ate up the energy.

I say cars are replaceable, people aren't. If we can't afford a reasonable priced new car or truck with reasonable protection then buy a used one that meets it. Full Size trucks need to meet it to.

To many people operate big vehicles and feel they can handle anything but we had two SUV fatalities in the area during the heavy snow because when you lose control and slid you pack a lot of mass and energy if the wreck and the driver is not as protected and feels and suffers from the impactin alarge truck/SUV.


To follow up on Zach's wreck. He bought a new 09 Corolla. Not because the tC is a bad car but when your life flashes before your eyes he wanted same but different in a vehicle. Oh, the somebeach in the SUV did not stop either; the old couple behind him did and called 911.

Teare

Get your facts straight my friend. The airbag was originally put into US auto production in the mid 70"s. Ford and GM were the first. They were not required until the late 80's.

kuo34

The majority of crushed roofs that I see on the job are the results of rollovers that get stopped by something with more mass (buildings, utility poles, trees) or large animal strikes. The only vehicle on that list that I've had personal experience with in an MVA is the Yaris broadsided by a modified F350 (ambulance, not my crew) rolling @ 50 mph. The four occupants of the Yaris came out with cuts and bruises and the car had no significant passenger cabin intrusion (>3" on side of impact). The F350 did not fare quite as well.

Size isn't everything in the world of vehicle impacts.

superemu

apples to apples comparison? I don't think there is any comparison. this isn't a contest.

heavy cars need heavy support so people don't die in it. it doesn't matter if tC weighs 3k and another vehicle weighs hojillion pounds. at the end of the day it's a matter of which one is going to hold up in a roll over and which one is going to get you killed.

tC4me

Hojillion pounds! Wow! That's a heavy car! (sorry, had to)

Nothinghead

Actually, a 4WD F250 XL weighs 6092 lbs. and if the roof can hold 1.7x its own weight = 10387 lbs. A tC weighs 2987 and its roof will hold 4.7x its own weight = 14039 lbs.

So you see, my little sport compact can withstand seven tons of force before collapsing while a 3/4 ton 4x4 can only withstand five.

That is COMPLETELY unacceptable.

No wonder ford is sinking as fast as GM and Chrysler.

Nothinghead

^ Oh yeah, if this law were to be in place, that means something built like the tC that could withstand a 14039 lb force and this only needed to be 2.5x the vehicle's weight, the vehicle could weigh as much as 14039/2.5=5616lbs.

ZOMGXB

Just because they were the first to put them in some cars doesn't mean they'd gleefully put them in all cars.

What about ABS and Vehicle Stability Control? They're both proven to save lives but still "an option" on a handful of cars. Liiiike...the Aveo, for instance. And the Cobalt. And the Focus, and the PT Cruiser, for that matter. But hey, they were standard on my xB, and your tC...and the xA and xD, as it happens. See also: Versa, Fit...uh, you probably know where this is going at this point.

The base Cobalt doesn't even come with ABS, and you expect me to believe it would would come with airbags if it wasn't federally required? All the evidence points to the contrary.

I guess I need to make more money for Detroit to bother with my safety.

Higgy

You can buy a stock civic without abs. Also there has recently been some kind of study showing the ABS may not be as good as people think.

heybog

Ditto on the ABS.

ZOMGXB

Sorry, my point was that Toyota puts basic (or what should be basic) safety features on every one of their cars.

And actually, studies showing that ABS is not the end-all of vehicle safety go back quite some time. The reigning theory for awhile now is something called "risk compensation": the idea that people who know their car has ABS will drive a little faster than if it didn't. It's kind of like how SUV drivers seem to think the "4-HIGH" button means "YOUR VEHICLE IS NOW IMMUNE FROM THE LAWS OF PHYSICS" and try to take turns at 45 MPH in the snow. All it proves is that anything can be dangerous in the hands of stupid people.

Personally, I can still tell you the license plate number of the Suburban I nearly plowed into in the rain at 55 MPH, where the only thing that saved me was the ability to stand on the brakes and swerve at the same time..and that was in 2004. So for me it's a little more obvious.

Which is why I get nervous when I rent a PT Cruiser, and every time I jam on the brakes it ends up facing a different direction. This is Chicago, people; you jam on the brakes a LOT.

Higgy

LOL. Yeah I get what your saying. I couldn't imagine driving a vehicle without ABS because im sure if I was about to be in a wreck I wouldnt want to have to worry about pumping the breaks and swerving and keeping calm and collective all at the same time. Id rather just smash the pedal and move.

Number2

I have a friend who doesn't wear a seatbelt because he thinks it is dangerous if you roll the car and you get stuck. And his g/f doesn't wear a seatbelt b/c he gets mad at her for wearing it (as if to say his driving skills are crap.)

Am I wrong to think these two are a few peas short of a pod?

Teare

Once again, it was Detroit who starting engineering and implementing these safety features way back in the 80's. My 1991 Chevy S10 had standard ABS.

Why does everyone have to bash on Detroit? If it wasn't for US automakers we wouldn't be driving the way we do now.

Not everyone want's ABS. None of my past 3 Toyota Camry's(1998, 2002, 2003) came with standard ABS. Nor did I want to pay the extra for it.

In fact when I ordered my 07 TC Side Air Bags were an option. So...I had to order, wait 4 weeks and pay the extra $650.00. I did this because it was my option. I didn't expect an economy car to have every safety feature available.

13edge

I can't stand ABS. For the most part they can keep traction control too, especially on track days.

rvpps2rocks

Just imagine a using your full force to smack a hammer on the ground compared to a sludge hammer hit the ground...which one is going to need better reinforcement.( hammer being tC, sludge hammer as SUV). if you made the weight the same for all cars the little cars would have overkill roof support and create too much extra weight which would contribute to alot of extra factors

CarbonXe

iTrader: (1)

Maybe car companies should start doing something to prevent roll overs. It's nice to know that I'll be safe IF it rolls over, but it's nicer to know that I'm driving a car that can't roll over. The BMW Z4 is a nice example of this. That thing is near impossible to roll, unless of course you hit a ramp with one side of the vehicle doing 160 mph.

optional

good to know, i was planning on dropping 2 and a half tC's on top of mine to see how that would pan out.

CarbonXe

iTrader: (1)

If you just slam on the breaks, in an ABS equipped vehicle, your stopping distance is significantly longer than if you smoothly applied them. ABS =/= shorter stopping distance. Yes, it's nice to have over not having it, but in a situation where braking is needed, and needed fast, it's a total waste (compared to smooth appliction, not compared to locking up the wheels).

d0ugch0i

hahaha nice..