AndrewGene

Okay, the tC is my first car to mod and I have a crack pulley put it. I won't keep this tC for anywhere near 100,000 miles so that doesn't bother me. However, having my engine rev faster and hearing it/feeling it has made my driving experience that much more fun. It is enjoyable to have it on despite it not having huge hp gains or shortening engine life from 200k to well over 100k.

Just my .02.

ElDiablo17

I passed the engine class in Toyota classes and understand most about the engine but I'm still learning. I believe that many vehicle companys tend to put the cheapest material quality that weight so much on the engine and other stuff then expect you to come back later in like 3 to 5 years later to buy a new one to keep their business going. I also believe that having a heavy crank pully and heavy flywheel putting much weight on the crankshaft makes the engine life decrease. Putting a light flywheel and crank pully will not decrase the engine life and I don't know if it increase the engine life which I'm not sure but it also accelerate faster. Some people says it increase HP and some don't, I think its either because light weight crank pully and flywheel helps the rotation to rev faster and push the transmission to accelerate quick.

For example, I don't know if this is true but its a same concept, if I was going to race against another stock tC but we got the same HP. I got light crank pully and flywheel and the other tc don't have any mods at all. I might have a little more HP than the stock tC but I accelerate 2X faster than the other tC and cut down the 1/4 time.

I think I did a lousy explaination but I'm not saying its the fact, I'm just saying its my opinion of what I believe and what I've learned. I've notice that the dampner in the tC is internal, not on the pully, I'm wrong but this is what I saw with my own eyes and my believes.

Hope this is helpful.

FYI, I'm not against UR and engifineer's comment but I think people who have more experience and has been rebuilding like 1,000 of engine a year or more and gain the experiences of everything. Nothing is perfect so I'm sure none of the product for our tC is perfect but almost :D.

Guys, it is ok to correct me if I'm wrong, we all are still learning

ElDiablo17

I would love to keep my tC forever and I wont trade it in or sell it. This will be my collector car in the future and if my engine doesnt last long, I will so rebuild it back to brand new. :D

engifineer

So if I am quoting data out of physics books.. then that is my opinion? That is a new one to me. If I say the sky is blue on a nice sunny day, and a colorblind man choses not to beleive me, that makes what I say opinion? Some idiots believe the holocaust never happened, so I guess that means for the rest of us it is just opinion.

I am not trying to attack you, just bustin your b@!!s a little and trying to make a point,

But we all know that only one person had a car at seven, and that was Chuck Norris, who built it out of dirt and sticks and made it run

In fact, I am not generally trying to attack anyone at all. While the arguments get heated, I dont take it personally for the most part. In fact, I think a good, long, healthy argument is good between people, even if they never agree. But I do wish that people would simply tell me how the arguments directly apply to the principles I mentioned, and how those principles (not me.. the basic principles I said to look up) are WRONG rather than start telling me I have no experience, no common sense, question my education, etc. Those things have nothing to do with it overall since nothing I mentioned is a concept created by me, simply laws that all of nature follows. So when people like to side step that and find other ways to argue, the conversation will get heated very quickly. Which is why the argument, as always, will never go any further. My fault as well as anyone elses for pursuing it.

jbae1221

^^^ actually that was macgyver and he did it out of a , paper clip 2 cents, a bag of rubberbands 2 dollars, a straw 5 cents, and spool of yarn 1.25, having a car at 7 priceless.. haha jk jk..
to me, opinions are like a$$holes, everyone has one and they all stink.. hehe. but facts are facts. the laws of physics are facts.
plus if you want to spend 150 dollars on a part that gives you little to no gains unless you are boosted.. now thats stupid and priceless. hahaha

engifineer

^ Ahh yes.. it was macgyver... Chuck would have just told the air to move him somewhere and it would be done. :D

ElDiablo17

I was planning to buying crank pully in the future but then again I rather wait til theres the right pully for the tC with actual gain and rev faster... I'm still confuse and have not seen an after market pully before so I don't know the difference between stock pully and after market pully, all I know is size and weight is a big difference but what pros and cons do they have or what other difference do they have. Damaging the engine or decrease engine life faster because of the pully is not what I'm looking for haha.

Sly_dawg19

Get a UR pulley or Perrin Pulley, they are high quality and low price.

the damper for the tC and xB, xA, is in the engine, not on the pulley.

dont worry about engine degradation with a new crank pulley, you dont make enough HP to even matter (now if you made 900+ then worry, and even then, its not a real worry)

The theory is that less rotational mass makes more power and rev faster. Rev faster is true, but, with our little engines, we dont see huge hp gains, we may see +2hp if we are lucky

ElDiablo17

I know the damper is in the engine, not the pully but it kinda worry me because the other threat from ystc had their engine mess up bad by the pully but you might be right, I'll go for UR pully or NST.... I like NST pully but I really don't know whats the different between NST and UR. If somebody can explain then that would be better.

Sly_dawg19

the difference between NST and UR is minute.

very very very little difference.

maybe color, and design of the spokes :p

if they kept OEM size and just reduced weight, there basically the same

if the under drove the pulley, then they may be a little different.

but the difference inst enouugh to feel or even dyno. just go with which one you like in looks on that decision.

now im not saying EVERYTHING is like that. but between NST and UR there both high quality. Perrin is nice too.

ElDiablo17

Sounds GREAT! Thanks Sly Dawq19

engifineer

Damper is not in the engine. The Harmonic BALANCER is in the engine. The vibration DAMPER is built into the pulley. And the engine needs it at its current power and rpm levels, hence the reason the company spent money to design and include it. High power is not the only thing that makes vibration. So I dont know where that misconception came from in his posts. Everything has a resonant frequency, and any number of shock loads can cause it. Again, the reason they spent r&d time to produce it. If you read lo_bux_racer or my posts on this thread that will be explained.

Sly_dawg19

so the damper is in the pulley? is it an injected rubber ring or something? ive stared and looked at my stock pulley for a long time and all i see is cast iron.

mattvs

It amazes me that after 4 pages of proof to the negative, there are still retards that are "in the middle" about installing these wastes of money onto their cars and thinking there are gains to be had.

SF2K4

I think the "In the middle" problem is there because (gains or not... which is why I'm not getting one) there's a long thread here about peopel using these pullies that have the potential to kill your engine in 1 mile or so but almost everyone has been going to several thousands without an issue... like I said, I back physics...

engifineer

Your pulley isnt all cast. Look very closely, there should be a layer sandwiched in between the pulley channel and the inner portion. It wont be a nice, soft rubber like you are expecting, but it is a softer material than the rest of the pulley.

engifineer

Instead of posting all the info we did, I guess we could have just provided these :

http://www.germanmotorcars.com/Dyno_...0inertia_1.htm

http://www.atiperformanceproducts.co.../101/index.htm

http://dinancars.com/whitepapersFile.asp?ID=5

http://www.tpub.com/content/engine/1.../14075_108.htm

http://www.suprasonic.org/public_htm...atedamper.html

But I am sure someone will say all of those people are "dumb" just like me and anyone who thinks this is a bad mod. But at least now you can go argue with them. For the rest, it will be good info to read and understand, since so many fail to address half the issues we have presented directly and correctly.

lo_bux_racer

If you can't even find the rubber in the damper (which is well documented), why would I trust anything you say? Apparently you slept through high school physics because you just don't understand what is going on here. The OEM item is a torsional damper. There is no balancer anywhere in the engine. There are counterbalance shafts that create vibration intentionally. I'll leave it to you to explain how that works (but if it's like your other explanations, you'll get it wrong too.)

Check out the 900 hp Supras. They all have a stock damper or an ATI/TCS/Fluidamper on them. No one is stupid enough to put a solid pulley on an engine making 800+ ft-lbs of torque for long.

N-Dawg

Listen up, If the crank Pulley doesn't generate noticable gains why even bother with it? I'm like very other guy trying to find the next thing to put in my car to make it go faster, but this seems like too much risk for such little gains. I think if you have a blower then a pulley might make a difference, but for N/A cars, we should just leave it like it is, peace.

Sly_dawg19

i recently found the rubber peice (yesterday) it is a thin pieve of rubber going around the pulley about in the middle. there isnt much rubber there, only a thin ring.

i said our engines, not 900 hp supras, of course they need dampers.

dont be so quick to be an ___. you can talk and opinionate without being a total jerkwad u know.

show me proof of scion engine failure due to not having a damper in the pulley and i will rethink my theories on our oem pulleys. im talking our engines with maybe intake headers and exhaust and a new pulley. I also notice how UR stopped replying to this thread, because there is alot of heat, and it isnt worth keeping the thread going for them.

I am not saying OEM pulleys are useless, and i am not saying that Damperless pulleys will keep OEM durability and engine life.

All im saying is there is a low power increase, and low durability decrease on engine life. Low enough that N/A scion engines dont need to worry about the decrease in durability, and also so low power gain you can spend 150 bucks better elsewhere.