Menace

? It is one piece, what does that have to do with anything? If one so desired they can go to a muffler shop and put a different muffler on our "axle-back". Those are different things. Thats like saying our mid-pipe is our cat.

Very incorrect. There is no tuning for sound in headers, or any other pipes in any exhaust. That's not their intended purpose. Sound is a pressure wave formed from pulses of alternating high and low air pressure. These pulses makes their way through the air at the speed of sound. In an engine, pulses are created when an exhaust valve opens and a burst of high-pressure gas suddenly enters the exhaust system. The molecules in this gas collide with the lower-pressure molecules in the pipe, causing them to stack up on each other. They in turn stack up on the molecules a little further down the pipe, leaving an area of low pressure behind. In this way, the sound wave makes its way down the pipe much faster than the actual gases do. This is also more pronounced in DOHC vehicles. Hence, depending on what setup you have an s-pipe can cause rasp. Also, there are a lot of people in this forum that have said an s-pipe increased their dB level along with additional rasp.

As far as performance effects of s-pipes, you have Megan 2.25", Invidia 60mm, and zpi 2.5". I would not recommend the ZPI one for N/A beacuse as Mugetsu stated there will be an a decrease in low end tourque. I will still stick to my opinion in regards to an s-pipe's performance. I don't think it should be the first mod, however like I said before, if most of the bolt ons are done, its more than justified. Something to think about: why did Weapon-R decide to utilize an s-pipe in their design? Beacuse it allowed them to gain more performnce and thats why they are currently hands down the best headers you can by for the tC.

Mugetsu

LOL man your like Arnold Schwarzenegger in twins "all theory no hands on experience" you love to argue for no reason other than the argument...

we've been down this road before...

Menace

I hate wasting time arguing with know-it-alls. Just because you changed your car's oil, measured an opening of a pipe, or even opened an engine up, does not make you an expert in all things cars. Let's get another thing straight, everything I said in my previous post is not theory, it's fact, and applies to any car, not just the tc. I could care less how many cars you've been under or how many times you've been to the greddy website. I've seen certified mechanics not knowing jack about what they are doing so it is irrelevant to me what your real world experiences consist of. The level of your argumentative gab of concocting facts and fiction to make a point is just silly.

My magical response would be this: I never said it makes more sense to switch out the muffler. But combining two separate terms is wrong and makes no sense. If any tc owner wanted to save money, they can go to a muffler shop, remove the muffler off their axle-back and get a muffler 1/3 its size with extra piping, which would cost maybe $100. Why you would even argue is beyond me. Under all the cars you've been under, I am sure you know that the tc is not the only car to utilize our type of muffler. Seems, You want to argue just for the sake of arguing.

Another misleading statement to make a point. When they are talking about "tunning" they are referring to the actual pulse not the sound produced. The sound is created by the shock wave from that pulse, not from the collision of the pulses. You did however get the resonance part right, but resonance and rasp are completely different. Size, length, shape, etc has an effect on the gas or pulse thats being forced out by the pistons, there would be a difference in sound as well but it will remain raspy no matter what unless a muffling device (resonator) is utilized. The better the design the more efficiently the pulses line up and pull each other along. They "tune" for performance reasons only (as stated in my previous post). No company, ever, makes a header to reduce rasp. That's not their goal. Headers are produced solely for performance, the tunning determines at what RPM range the header excels.

I know you don't mean to be Captain Obvious, but... You didn't answer my question. I asked you why they chose to intentionally design their header that way during tuning? They could have done without the s-pipe, like the some of the other 4-2-1 headers they designed. There is also a 4-2-1 header that exists for the tc and it doesnt utilize the s-pipe as well, yet weapon-r chose to implement it in their design, why?. Once again, reason being is that their design yields more power than any other header on the market right now.

Mid_Life_tC-risis

OK you guys are getting too personal now & I think the original poster's question has been answered. I think we've all said our peace on this matter and we've drifted too far off-topic (and I'm guilty of doing that as as well.)

I think this thread has run it's course. All that's left now is for the OP to post back and say, "Sorry I should have posted in the F/I section - I really meant TURBO down pipe!".

Menace

This is not the first time, we had another thread locked. Difference of opinion for instance that you and I may have, I respect, but this guy comes off as an all knowing car wizard when in reality, well, he knows not so much. The worst part is he imposes his inaccuracies on you as if they were facts.

Mugetsu

You should take your own critique there Arnold, since you popped up on these forums you've done nothing but talk theory(wrong too) based on crap you read or heard from hearsay.

nothing i mean nothing thats ever come out of your mouth has ever made any sense in the "actual" world its all fancy Fauntleroy "university" jargon. and general terminology.

I act the way i act towards you because you pose such obviously wrong points and then argue them to death with fancy boy speak.

Example: your cute lil theory on tuned exhausts which is complete BS and off point in any relevant way to what i stated regarding tuned exhausts...

Just face it your useless around cars, talking the finer points about a header isn't magically going to install it on your car.

And its not just me, all the posts i run across with you posting in them has you arguing with some one who has actually done the work not just read up on it like you.
yet you try to college speak your way around being wrong...

Menace

LOL I'll take most of what you said as a compliment. I am also on physicsforums.com, if you ever want to know how an engine really works, that forum maybe a good start to supplement your "doing the work your self" motto. Who knows, you may even learn something from the other "college boys" who actualy Design the parts that you Install. One correction though, I've been on SL way longer than you have. For everything else refer to my two previous posts. Last, word of advice: read up on some of the "jargon" I talked about.

This is my last post, you can go ahead and get the last word.

Sleep3r

looks like you won the last word game menace

Mugetsu