New clutch and flywheel installed
06-12-2005, 06:51 AM
#21
Senior Member
SL Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Minneapolis
Posts: 1,629
Originally Posted by Matt687
the ricer boys have a new competition to fear 
. I wish I owned my Tc so I could mod the hell out of it, 3 stage turbo, clutch and flywheel, suspension, wide body, brakes, the whole works. I may have to buy my car at the end of this lease so I can mod it out.
. I wish I owned my Tc so I could mod the hell out of it, 3 stage turbo, clutch and flywheel, suspension, wide body, brakes, the whole works. I may have to buy my car at the end of this lease so I can mod it out.To lease or not to lease - I'm really glad I opted for "not to lease" - I've had it since September and already have around 18k on it. That's a bit above and beyond the lease requirement, isn't it?
06-13-2005, 06:16 AM
#24
Member
SL Member
Join Date: May 2004
Posts: 88
i only leased because my pops works for toyota, so i get company lease, free service, free insurance, cheap lease payments. besides my car is just a tool for me for A to B travel as soon as I get my yamaha R1 or build my chopper
06-16-2005, 09:42 PM
#26
Senior Member
SL Member
Team ScioNRG
Join Date: Jun 2005
Posts: 1,512
Does anyone know if this 2.4L motor is internally balanced, so adding a light flywheel will not throw off the balance of the crank/roda/pistons? That is why some cars will see rough idling and short engine bearing life when they add a lightened flywheel or crank pulley, it throws off the balance.
Also CELs can occur with light flywheels because you are lightening up the crank shaft and when the cylinders fire, the forces transferred to the crank via the rods are now absorbed differently as the balance of the rotating assembly has changed. The knock sensor can detect this as excessive knock, or it can be picked up by the crank sensor as a misfire and throw a code. I have seen it on a few cars, however usually this occurs when a high profile camshaft is used causing the engine to lope. The phantom knock created by the cam is accentuated by the light flywheel.
I am not a fan of light flywheels...I have one on a car here that I drive every day and it is just no fun. Never had sucess with the daily driven car with the light flywheel. Of course it is not a scion either.
Ok, well, just some food for thought there.
Also CELs can occur with light flywheels because you are lightening up the crank shaft and when the cylinders fire, the forces transferred to the crank via the rods are now absorbed differently as the balance of the rotating assembly has changed. The knock sensor can detect this as excessive knock, or it can be picked up by the crank sensor as a misfire and throw a code. I have seen it on a few cars, however usually this occurs when a high profile camshaft is used causing the engine to lope. The phantom knock created by the cam is accentuated by the light flywheel.
I am not a fan of light flywheels...I have one on a car here that I drive every day and it is just no fun. Never had sucess with the daily driven car with the light flywheel. Of course it is not a scion either.
Ok, well, just some food for thought there.
06-16-2005, 09:47 PM
#27
Senior Member
SL Member
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Malibu, CA
Posts: 1,444
your argument has been brought up before, and they are valid. Knowledgeable members of this site have concured with you that a light weight flywheel would not be good for the long term life of the engine.
06-17-2005, 02:23 AM
#29
Senior Member
SL Member
Join Date: May 2005
Posts: 1,726
How hard is it to keep a steady speed at city driving?
I'll need to be driving a short distance to school and back (living next to university = save money for car stuffs!) so staying at around 45-55 mph is a necessity. The fastest my city has is 60 mph.. oh well.. In any case, there's also traffic necessitating 30 mph-ish. If the acceleration is that much faster I can't afford to get a lightened flywheel due to the risk of rear ending another car and/or risking constant stalling due to driving at a low speeds at really low rpms.
But I really don't know much about this stuff..
I'll need to be driving a short distance to school and back (living next to university = save money for car stuffs!) so staying at around 45-55 mph is a necessity. The fastest my city has is 60 mph.. oh well.. In any case, there's also traffic necessitating 30 mph-ish. If the acceleration is that much faster I can't afford to get a lightened flywheel due to the risk of rear ending another car and/or risking constant stalling due to driving at a low speeds at really low rpms.
But I really don't know much about this stuff..
06-17-2005, 02:54 AM
#30
Senior Member
SL Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Minneapolis
Posts: 1,629
Originally Posted by kungpaosamuraiii
How hard is it to keep a steady speed at city driving?
I'll need to be driving a short distance to school and back (living next to university = save money for car stuffs!) so staying at around 45-55 mph is a necessity. The fastest my city has is 60 mph.. oh well.. In any case, there's also traffic necessitating 30 mph-ish. If the acceleration is that much faster I can't afford to get a lightened flywheel due to the risk of rear ending another car and/or risking constant stalling due to driving at a low speeds at really low rpms.
I'll need to be driving a short distance to school and back (living next to university = save money for car stuffs!) so staying at around 45-55 mph is a necessity. The fastest my city has is 60 mph.. oh well.. In any case, there's also traffic necessitating 30 mph-ish. If the acceleration is that much faster I can't afford to get a lightened flywheel due to the risk of rear ending another car and/or risking constant stalling due to driving at a low speeds at really low rpms.
06-17-2005, 05:12 AM
#31
Senior Member
SL Member
Join Date: May 2005
Posts: 1,726
Ok, I had thought all that was a myth and so it probably is. Maybe my "source" was talking about a titanium flywheel or something..
What about gas milage? I imagine that since less power is being wasted spinning the flywheel and more of it pushes the car that less gas is needed to maintain the same speed. Is this true? Not my friend speaking anymore, this is what I conjectured on my own.
What about gas milage? I imagine that since less power is being wasted spinning the flywheel and more of it pushes the car that less gas is needed to maintain the same speed. Is this true? Not my friend speaking anymore, this is what I conjectured on my own.
06-17-2005, 05:17 AM
#32
Senior Member
SL Member
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Gilbert, AZ
Posts: 2,912
Our engines do have a balanced forged crankshaft so that wouldn't be an issue.
There are usually 3 weight stages for flywheels. The OEM of course is easiest to drive. It keeps engine momentum which helps for 1st gear engagement at a red light or hill. The lighter one is usually around 11-13.5 pounds. Your engine will rev faster (good for response), but be harder to launch at low rpms/speeds because of loss of momentum.
For anyone who know's physics, it's the law of intertia. Inertia is the resistance to change in it's current state or motion, or lack of, and it's persistance to remain in motion once in motion.
Higher intertia flywheels are much easier for clutch engagement, and is what aids you in chirping the tires when you slam 1st to 2nd, or event 3rd to 4th. Low intertia flywheels will be much harder to launch, because the motor itself has to do all of the work, instead of being aided by "virtual wieght".
Now on a positive note, there is one major advantage to light flywheels. Once in gear, there is less intertia for the engine to over come. It now doesn't have to work as hard to get the rpms to climb, including the tire speed/acceleration.
With a flywheel, your crank horsepower is identical, but you add more effiecy thus increasing your wheel horsepower. It's up to you to decide the correct balance of driveability and performance.
One final note (I know I keep dropping short ones)... OEM is never best for performance regardless. The mid-weight guys are designed for street and drag use. Ultra-lightweight flywheels are intended for road course use only (high speed racing) and are not suggested for turbo-charged vehicles in most cases. They make it nearly impossible for consistant launches at the track (usally either severe lag from lack of momentum, or too much tire spin from revving slightly too high).
Hopefully that helps you guys choose what's right for you.
There are usually 3 weight stages for flywheels. The OEM of course is easiest to drive. It keeps engine momentum which helps for 1st gear engagement at a red light or hill. The lighter one is usually around 11-13.5 pounds. Your engine will rev faster (good for response), but be harder to launch at low rpms/speeds because of loss of momentum.
For anyone who know's physics, it's the law of intertia. Inertia is the resistance to change in it's current state or motion, or lack of, and it's persistance to remain in motion once in motion.
Higher intertia flywheels are much easier for clutch engagement, and is what aids you in chirping the tires when you slam 1st to 2nd, or event 3rd to 4th. Low intertia flywheels will be much harder to launch, because the motor itself has to do all of the work, instead of being aided by "virtual wieght".
Now on a positive note, there is one major advantage to light flywheels. Once in gear, there is less intertia for the engine to over come. It now doesn't have to work as hard to get the rpms to climb, including the tire speed/acceleration.
With a flywheel, your crank horsepower is identical, but you add more effiecy thus increasing your wheel horsepower. It's up to you to decide the correct balance of driveability and performance.
One final note (I know I keep dropping short ones)... OEM is never best for performance regardless. The mid-weight guys are designed for street and drag use. Ultra-lightweight flywheels are intended for road course use only (high speed racing) and are not suggested for turbo-charged vehicles in most cases. They make it nearly impossible for consistant launches at the track (usally either severe lag from lack of momentum, or too much tire spin from revving slightly too high).
Hopefully that helps you guys choose what's right for you.
06-17-2005, 06:12 AM
#33
Senior Member
SL Member
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: DFW
Posts: 142
Congrats draven! Let me know how the ride goes in a couple of hundred miles. I almost got the stage IV...but glad I didn't. My car has 23k miles, and I had it only since last August. I hope the turbo arrives b4 my warranty expires.
06-17-2005, 03:48 PM
#36
Senior Member
SL Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Minneapolis
Posts: 1,629
Originally Posted by jbae1221
how heavy is the oem flywheel.. and where can you find a mid wieght flywheel? and how hard would it be to install a flywheel??
As far as installation - it's roughly a 6 hour job and if you're going to do it I highly recommend getting a new clutch with it because it's the exact procedure to replace the clutch.
I should try to get a video camera and get you guys a vid of what it sounds like and of a launch. Maybe after the breakin period.
06-17-2005, 06:55 PM
#37
Senior Member
SL Member
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: Portland, OR
Posts: 573
Originally Posted by Joe@Dezod
Higher intertia flywheels are much easier for clutch engagement, and is what aids you in chirping the tires when you slam 1st to 2nd, or event 3rd to 4th. Low intertia flywheels will be much harder to launch, because the motor itself has to do all of the work, instead of being aided by "virtual wieght".
Now on a positive note, there is one major advantage to light flywheels. Once in gear, there is less intertia for the engine to over come. It now doesn't have to work as hard to get the rpms to climb, including the tire speed/acceleration.
One final note (I know I keep dropping short ones)... OEM is never best for performance regardless. The mid-weight guys are designed for street and drag use. Ultra-lightweight flywheels are intended for road course use only (high speed racing) and are not suggested for turbo-charged vehicles in most cases. They make it nearly impossible for consistant launches at the track (usally either severe lag from lack of momentum, or too much tire spin from revving slightly too high).
Hopefully that helps you guys choose what's right for you.
Now on a positive note, there is one major advantage to light flywheels. Once in gear, there is less intertia for the engine to over come. It now doesn't have to work as hard to get the rpms to climb, including the tire speed/acceleration.
One final note (I know I keep dropping short ones)... OEM is never best for performance regardless. The mid-weight guys are designed for street and drag use. Ultra-lightweight flywheels are intended for road course use only (high speed racing) and are not suggested for turbo-charged vehicles in most cases. They make it nearly impossible for consistant launches at the track (usally either severe lag from lack of momentum, or too much tire spin from revving slightly too high).
Hopefully that helps you guys choose what's right for you.
That is probably why Indy car's light them up on the launch, not because of gear ratio but because the flywheel (along with other things that we don't need to get into on this thread) is so light they have no choice.
06-17-2005, 07:18 PM
#38
Senior Member
SL Member
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Harrisburg, PA
Posts: 400
I'm just curious.....where do you people whom put these mods on get your money?? haha....
I'm stuck in the real world with rent/bills/bills/bills and more bills....I'm comfortable but there is no way I could just go out and drop a grand on a clutch and flywheel installed...
Just bein curious is all...
I'm stuck in the real world with rent/bills/bills/bills and more bills....I'm comfortable but there is no way I could just go out and drop a grand on a clutch and flywheel installed...
Just bein curious is all...
06-17-2005, 07:24 PM
#39
Senior Member
SL Member
Join Date: May 2005
Posts: 2,045
i eat sammiches for lunch, slim fast for breakfast (i'm uber skinny but they're fast/cheap), and i eat something i cook for dinner. i barely ever go out. i own the house i live in.. no mortgage...
live cheap! then your $ can go to mods LOL
of course it does help that i doubled my income in the last 4 months
live cheap! then your $ can go to mods LOL
of course it does help that i doubled my income in the last 4 months
06-17-2005, 07:48 PM
#40
Senior Member
SL Member
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: Portland, OR
Posts: 573
Ditto on the sammiches and cheap bfast... also make my own dinner.... saves tons of cash! I do go out tho, often... work hard & play harder. I don't own my house, but the mortgage is do able... wish I doubled my income in the last 4 months. Well, I sort of did cuz I put the woman to work! Buahaha! =)