jmiller20874

It's supposed to be shipping mid-october. But yes it definitely looks like it is coming out.

SCIONPARTS

I cant wait to drive and hear this thing. I know it wont be anything crazy but Im sure it will be a lot more fun to drive

DynomyteSW

what i am curious to see is if it will work w/ an aftermarket header i would think so as long as nothing bolts up to the heat shield.... hmmm

apexjr

Sure there is, it's the type of SC it is. Not only that but all that HP you get will be on the top end, gradually building up. It's good for a few reasons. If you mash the gas to the floor already you get wheel spin in 2nd on midly modified TC's. With a turbo you can burn thru 3rd because of all the TQ down low. The SC tries to give all that HP without making you burn off rubber. Thus it should perform a lot like it does stock with more pull in the upper RPMs. You will really notice it at the top of 3rd and going into 4th. Down below that not as much.

In other words, if both the TRD and ZPI kit gave you say 240whp, because of the *space below the curve* the turbo will always walk away from you at the begining, maybe the SC would hold with it after the first few seconds but by then the turbo's already ahead.

It's not a matter of how much power, but how its being delivered. Even if it gave us 240whp it wouldn't feel like the ZPI kit. It's not that kind of SC.

People buying the SC shouldn't just look at the HP/TQ numbers, but how it changes drivability. It's going to be much more mellow then the turbo's just by the nature of the type of SC it is.

jmiller20874

So I'm to believe that 7psi from a centrifugal S/C is a different 7psi that I'd get from a roots-type, screw-type or even turbo.

Last time I checked, 7psi is 7psi, period. The engine knows no difference. If anything the boost curve from a centrifugal S/C will be closest to a turbo since they compress the air in the same fashion, just one is belt-driven instead of turbine driven. The compressor side is identical. Both will exhibit lag, now how much we don't know yet.

Have you seen a dyno chart that the rest of us haven't?

apexjr

Sure in some aspects 7psi is 7psi.. again it's how its delivered and how it's created. The TRD SC is a centrifugal SC.

The following is taken from a nice website... provided here for information.

---
There are two basic types of superchargers, positive displacement and centrifugal.

The centrifugal superchargers use the same type of compressor impeller as a turbocharger and the faster they spin the more boost they make and it is not linier. If you double the speed of the compressor you quadruple the output. The problem is that they only make peak boost at the engine's redline and tend to make very little boost at lower engine speeds where they are mostly operated. These are the type used by the well known Paxton and Vortech brand. In automotive use they really are not the best choice because of the very wide RPM ranges used in normal operation. They are very well suited for aircraft use where the engines are operated in a very narrow RPM range the entire time the aircraft is in flight. There are many auto manufactures that are using positive displacement superchargers on their cars, Mercedes, Jaguar, Ford, GM, Saab and many more. Not a single one that I know of is using a centrifugal supercharger. There must be a real good reason for that.

The positive displacement supercharger will move a fixed amount of air on each rotation and that is not dependant on impeller speed as it is on the centrifugal type. When a positive displacement supercharger's size is properly matched to an engine and it turned at fixed ratio to engine speed it will produce a set amount of boost throughout almost the entire RPM band, from just off idle to full RPM. There are great advantages to this over the centrifugal type superchargers and that is why they are the better choice.

-------

The other type are like, roots and the new modified roots, like an eaton etc. Most TRD SC that I know of if not all have been a modified roots blower. Why they choose to use this centrifugal type this time I don't know. I do know that it won't feel like the turbo's. It will have .5 psi very near idle and build to 7psi (or whatever) at the top end.

Like I said. Buyers of this TRD SC shouldn't look at raw numbers but the power delivery curve to make a choice. If you want head whipping power from 2500rpm this SC will not do that, a turbo will.

jmiller20874

Good info there, but I'll pass judgement when I see a dyno graph. Vortech has goten some rave reviews on some of their S2000 and 350Z work. So I'll remain highly skeptical of the given numbers until further notice.

matty-tC

psi isn't psi when it comes to compressor efficiency (heat of the intake charge)

but you have to realize this supercharger takes away power to create the compressed intake charge.

7psi on our cars basically means you're running a 3.6L engine (as far as the VE is concerned).... but the curve and application of the power to the ground is a big chunk of how good the car is as a whole

lo_bux_racer

Solid points all. Having owned turbo'd and roots blower'd cars, there is an excellent point to be understood here, they're going to make power differently. The one thing we don't know so far is what the dyno looks like, so any speculation about which will be what is just that: speculation.

FWIW, we really don't know when the 7 psi will be available from the supercharger, it doesn't have to be a linear climbing graph at all, and since the efficiency of both turbo and supercharger is not constant at all pressure ratios and rpm, we really don't know anything until we see the results.

DynomyteSW

really cant wait to see dynos, hear sound clips and vids!

zer0race

if you notice on the last stages it says to put on the tamper proof plastic cap , so if you installed the kit yourself you wont have to worry bout not being able to replace the pully for extra boost , becus you dont have to put on the cap ,

lo_bux_racer

Sure, but if you show up with four holed pistons, do you really think they aren't going to figure it out?

tCb00b

iTrader: (1)

Not if you take of the s/c before going in for service, just play dumb and deal with the guilt trip. LOL

superbill

yeah and thats alot of work^^...listen i dont know if i am the only one that feels this way, but this is like the thousand time this system is claimed to be coming soon, just whats different this time that warrants believing it ?..installation instructions? i asked my dealer yesterday when it was coming and was told soon ..i think?

FLINT

i'm not goin to believe it yet cuz they gave an estimate shippin date. thats not concrete enough.

Scion-ce

I truly believe this time. End of October should put an end to the countless threads about the supercharger release date. and what follows? Countless threads about the supercharger performance. Here we go again. I sure hope this s/c spools fairly quickly as opposed to climbing gradually

skyy

I spoke to TRD and they told me the supercharger is available for dealer purchase on 10/10/05. So it looks like it's the real deal this time. ^_^; As soon as I sell my del sol I'll be buying the tC w/ the S/C and taking it to the dyno immediately. So it all just depends on how soon I sell my del sol.

I wonder what the gas mileage will be with the S/C during daily driving? That's one good thing about the turbo... adding lower compression makes lower hp numbers when you aren't in boost, so you get hella good gas mileage. Turbo's still rule the power world, no doubt, but I want my warrenty. I know tons of people w/ turbo's on other cars of all kinds, installed at shops, and run into weekly problems. With a lot of power comes more problems, no matter who installs it. :p

cfusionpm

took the words right outta my mouth.

FLINT

i realize that the stock sc power is the same as the saturn ion and chevy cobalt sc power. 200-205. thats where we were ment to b in the 1st place. as 4 all yal that have turbos, i hope that the government doesnt pass a 50 state clean air law for car emissions. if they do, your F'ed!

400amonth

The only thing that really bums me is the low torque number. I just don't get that. Getting a TC over 200 foot pounds of torque would be so nice. I only can hope that with a header more dynamic numbers may be achieved. I as others have mentioned think that re-map may be knocking the numbers down. I hope some one is able to dyno this on a stock computer with a good a/f meter & knock sensor installed.