stl_tc_king

So, I been kinda lookin at Nitrous systems and the more I look, the more I think I want one.

Only thing is, I don't know much about them. I know how they work, but I still have a few questions that hopefully someone can help me answer. I want to make an educated move, not just slap some part on that I know nothing about.

1) How do I know what size shot to use (i want to be safe)?
2) Difference between wet/ dry kits? Advantages/ Disadvantages?
3) Difference between name brands (why is one different from another, and any personal preferences)?
4) Any other info that i need to know?
5) Recomendations/ warnings?

I found a website that seems very informative, but I haven't had time to read it all yet:
http://www.diy-nitrous.fsnet.co.uk/index.htm

PLEASE HELP!!!

David616

iTrader: (1)

Talk to WeDriveScions.

mike6789k

1) Start with a 35 or 50 shot max.
2) Drys kit's are easier to install, but are more dangerous as they create a more lean condition, and you can run up to a 50 shot wet kit with no tuning (and it's not THAT much harder to setup, just an extra line/solenoid)
3) eh, i used to like zex, now i like nx, if you want to get a cheap wet kit, get the mainline kit, it's only 399!
4) you dont need a window or TPS switch as long as YOU know only to engage nitrous at WOT and between 3000 and 5500 rpms, (dont spray while bouncing of the rev limiter... while the tC has an ignition cut off limiter, you wont damage your car too much, but it still isnt a smart thing to do)

you will probably want a purge kit too to clean air out of your lines (will cause a very rich condition and could cause stalling / very sluggish engine for about a second) and it looks cool!
5) oh, i guess i covered that in part 4

Agent47

This is my opinion and results after months of search. Nitrous is just as safe as any force induction system out there and requires that you do it right or else. for peace of mind this is what I got:
1)EFI Wet Nitrous kit (Cold Fusion is a quality yet non-expensive brand).
2)Bottle heater kit (again Cold Fusion is very complete and accessible).
3)Purge kit. (Optional but I highly recommend it).
4)Window switch (It's not expensive at all and yoy'll get better results, not to mention safety).
5)AT tranny cooler (If applicable).
6)colder spark plugs.
All for under $800
The installation is not as complicated as with other FI options but requires that you be very careful. after all my hard work this are my numbers: 75 shot
60' - 2.358
1/8 - 9.581 @ 74.63mph
1/4 - 14.754 @ 96.3mph

stl_tc_king

Thanks for your help. I've been looking at Zex (part # 82011) dry kit.

I talked to the technicians at Zex and they want to know if the fuel pressure regulator is accessible and has an available vacuum line.

Do any of you know off the top of your head, because I haven't checked yet.

trdsparks

Well here's my $.02.

You will need to switch to copper plugs. I prefer NGK's. If you try to use an Irridum or platinum plug you'll probably burn the tips off on the first spray. On most cars you can get away with runing a 50 shot and not have to retard the timing abd for every 10 over that you should pull the timing back 2 degrees. Don't try anything over a 75 shot. If you really want a dry shot that's on you but I would suggest you get the wet kit just dues to the fact it's safer. (there really isn't a way to safely spray a car) You don't have to have a bigger fuel pump but it's always nice to have that little extra insurance. You can pick up a Walbro 255L for $100 now. I would also suggest a WOT switch no matter what anyone tells you. Forget the "fast and furious" push botton. That's for people who either really know what they're doing or for those who just want to blow something up. Window switch it totally optional but again good insurance. Just remember to never spray past 6K rpms and you're good. If you tach the car out it cuts fuel and that's REALLY bad for N2O. So don't do that. One of the easiest kits to install in a Zex kit. NX is a great kit to as well as NOS. You really can't go wrong.

Here's a site that sell N2O accessories if you're looking for stuff.

http://www.dynotunenitrous.com/store...ts/default.asp

mike6789k

tC cuts off ignition, not fuel for rev limiter... so it's alright to hit rev limiter with nitrous spraying... just a waste of N2O though... nothing bad will happen.

trdsparks

Ok my mistake. But you can't say nothing bad will happen.......

mike6789k

what bad will happen? nitrous leaves the chamber before ignition ever starts again!

trdsparks

Ok try it and let me know what happens.

mike6789k

just did, car bogged a little, nothing else. desu

Stripper

https://www.scionlife.com/forums/viewtopic.php?t=141636

racetested

I see a lot of misinformation here and that's part of the reason nitrous is "considered" dangerous.

1) Iridium plugs are succesfully used with many nitrous motors. Motors vary and you need to figure out what works best with your application. There is no universal great plug.

2) How much you spray depends on many factors, jet location, fixed hit or progressive, pump or race fuel.

3) The BIG misconception is the kits available and what is better. I doubt anyone on here could tell me the noticable differences between systems as there really are none.

4) Dry kits are the future of nitrous and "better" if set up properly. Nitrous just needs to catch up with technology and use an electronic fuel controller instead of trying to fool a fuel pressure regulator which is very inconsistant for adding the proper fuel.

Nitrous is VERY safe if nitrous companies and people would know a little more about it instead of converting industrial parts that were never designed for nitrous.

trdsparks

You're wrong about the plugs. You will need colder plugs when you're spraying that's just a fact and you'll burn up the Irridum and platinum plugs.

I can't see how a dry shot could ever be a better or safer way to go if you're running over a 50 shot. You will have major issues with leaning out. I do agree that if there there a better way to control fuel then it wouldn't much matter whether you went wet or dry. But you're also talking about upgrading your fuel system e.i. injectors fuel pump ect. If the injectors can't keep up then the "electronic fuel controller" is usless.

This motor probably won't handle anything over 100 shot on it's best day with some major tuning and still start everyday. I could be a little off but not by much.

racetested

No disrespect Josh as you have provided good service to me on trd parts but I live and breathe nitrous every day as it's my livelyhood and I have a good handle on the rights and wrongs of nitrous.

1) Platinum plugs can melt but not iridium. You can confirm this right on NGk's website if you don't believe me. Iridium plugs actually perform better on some applications and as I said it varies.

2) I never said you don't need a colder plug?

3) How can you not see a dry shot being better? Fuel injection replaced carburetors a long time ago and nitrous needs to follow which it has on race bikes and cars. Now we are working on cheaper versions as cheaper parts become available "compared" to a full Motec sytem or similiar that race teams use.

3) Time will tell what the Scion TC can handle for nitrous but I have customers and friends using a 100-150 shot all day long on Civics and Celica's so a bigger displacement and lower compression motor in a TC should have no issues.

On that note what makes you think lean-outs are caused by the type of kit being a dry or wet? The answer is wet kits have just as big a problem ranging from nozzle design which also leads to distribution issues. That hard hit people associate with nitrous is an actual lean-out until the fuel catches up and mixes properly with the nitrous.

trdsparks

OK just so you know I'm not taking a shot at you just wanting all the correct info to be out here for everyone.

As a rule of thumb so to speak I have always been told to use copper plugs. So that's what I say that. (old dog new tricks)

The odds of you running lean with a dry kit are higher than with a wet kit. True either one can lean-out given the circumstances but the wet kit helps prevent this does it not? Unless you have some kind of fuel management with a dry kit you are limited on the shot you can run safely.

100 -150 shot on any 4 cylinder is dangerous. It can be done but the longevity and integrity of the engine are going to me shortened. I mean with enough time, motion, pressure and money you can pull anything off.

What kind of cars have you seen running irridum plugs? and what size shot?

racetested

Josh,
No offense taken as long as we remain in an open minded mature discussion.

You are not off base with the copper plugs and I use them often but some vehicles run better with the iridums which range from small 4 cylinders up to 700hp V-8's. The nice thing about iridums is they take less energy to ignite and this works in the favor of people with weak ignitions or on the brink of taxing an ignition which may not ignite the copper plugs.

All things have pluses and minuses. Manifolds are getting more and more complex and don't welcome flowing "wet" fuel which can promote fuel drop-out and poor distribution. This is one of the reasons direct port is needed.

Dry kits can only go so far with factory injectors as you say but this may be all you need for most power increases and a small increase in injector size along with a basic fuel management and rising rate regulator can cover all the other needs for "street"cars while remaining very driveable. NOW all dry kits on the market for cars currently are not that favorable as all they do is trick the fuel presure regulator and add more fuel. What I am talking about is doing it electronically based off factory sensors and engine load. As I said above basic electronics are becoming more and more available to do this relatively cheap.

There are other pluses to this but that's our secrets.

Pressure on a piston and connecting rod is "not" a serious issue if brought in linearly up to a certain level as any part will fail eventually. The main problem is people who run lean and detonate with a bad tune that cause things to break as the pressure spike is astrynomical. Motors can handle more than people think if "tuned" properly.

Also nitrous is safer than boost as it makes most of it's gains down low with the added torque as where boost makes most of it's gains higher in the rpm band where frcition/heat cause more damage. Think of a low reving diesel motor and how they last much longer than a high reving motor.

trdsparks

I can agree with you on pretty much everything you said and I see your points. I did not know that about iridium plugs though. Good to know.

scion-tc-turbo

Just to tell you that you cant install a dry kit on a tc because the fuel pressure reg, doesnt have a vac line to it and tc's dont have a return fuel system so you have to use a wet kit. I had gotten a Dry NOS kit for my TC and it wouldnt work i had to spend more money and get a Wet conversion kit....


theres my $0.2 thanks all

06sandpearl

yeah it has to be a wet shot, zex is the easiest to install