Simplyscion

It would be a long a$$ walk back to Tennessee
I got news for you Scion-ce you aint to far from beating stage 0s also...all it takes is a $100 Non Stop Tuning pulley and your set.

Scion-ce

Oh you mean the $100 Non Stop Tuning pulley that my grandma threw away Bah! I'll wait awhile before I decided to get another one. That really blows!!

Stu_Gotti

That sucks!

Garage1217

iTrader: (5)

Prove me wrong then supreme commander, you know how many independant dyno's have already been ran that prove the headers do add power to the setup? LOTS do a freaking search. Heck you were not even aware there was a belt slip problem with the factory tensioner and that has been discussed for months!! And you think an 11 psi pulley that is TINY is going to not slip at all?? Sorry man but now I really have lost ALL faith in your company when you come out and act like this. I was not ripping you on my post, I posted facts from what we have come to find with vortechs. I have 2 buddies with them on mustangs, 1 on a vr6, one on an s2000 and you think they all made more hp on a stock exhaust system? OMG no. And just so you know I am at a shop weekly with a dyno and supra's that will rip yours a new one, yeah I went there since you want to make an **** of yourself and want to be all high and mighty. Your supra turn 1450+ whp yet..?? Turn 1650whp+ yet?? I have been building race motors since I was 18, probably not near as long as you but long enough to know when somthing works and when something does not and definitly when somthing is a crock of crap. Again you just DO NOT GET IT. There are already dynos out of before and after with headers! They all prove you WRONG!



Also you claim my post is "how a Turbo kit works" Your turbo kits in the lower rpm only make 2 psi? Have you even seen the boost gauge on a vortech or one on our scions? I make about 2 psi at 60 mph in 5th gear. They are RPM dependant. Also have you even SEEN a header on a tc? The stock header? I really do not think you have because you would not be making such outlandish claims about the stock header making more power, it does not even flow well enough for stock output! Again use the little red search button and ask the n/a guys how much power they are gaining from a header!

Your also the very first tuning company I have ever seen that was not totally full of crap that would make claims on a new car that they have only tested a tiny few of "looks to be 1 car" and have not even done the a header test but claim it is the a fact of life the stock header makes more power because vortech says so even though vortech fully admits when I call them that they have washed there hands clean of the trd kit and it was produced to trd's specs and they will not make anything or support anything on the sc for us! I also asked the tech about backpressure, he said the same thing I did, to much is a bad thing and to little is a bad thing in the bottm end with there style of sc. He flat out said and I quote "For the most part it is a balancing act with an exhaust system" sound similar to what I said? DUH. *LOL*

Scion-ce

Lets all just calm down until the dynos are done

rhythmnsmoke

When I said Un-tuned, I meant he was throwing CEL's and running only a Stage 0, and nothing else. WHICH TO MENTION....HE STILL WON FROM A DIG! So, all he probably would have to do is slap on an exhaust and it would have been no Contest. Sorry dude...S/C = OVERPRICED. As for the S/C it should stand for "Slow Crap"... If a FMIC, and E-manage are OPTIONAL on the Stage 0 and you eqquip them, then what does it make it....cause it's still not a Stage 1. So, does it become all of a sudden a Stage 0.5? Still a Stage 0 IMO, because you still would be running 6-6.5psi.

PS...You don't even run a S/C anymore..



So, you going to Pay for all my gas and a room for the night right? If it's at your expense, then I will come all the way there. But if I have to shell out just money on a trip just to whoop up on you, then it's not worth it (You don't get under my skin that much to waste money smokin your a$$). I don't have anything to prove either. I don't run my mouth every five post like you do, talking about "Oh, my S/C can do this, and my S/C can do that"... You crack me up bro. My grandmothers station wagon does better in the 1/4 mile...


Oh man, I almost choked on my drink. You think you going to beat me with just a pulley, then you better take out everything except your dash and drivers seat for some weight savings. I'll see if Kenny wants to get in on this, if you are paying for my trip. I'm sure he would love to take you to school.



I love getting a rise out of you and Munch. You guys make ScionLife fun. You talk a lot, but never back it up with any sorta dyno, video, data...Nothing. Not even so much as a recent updated picture of your car (unless I just missed a recent post).

All is fair in Love and War.

I'll have something for you in a month, month-1/2. PayPal account has been, and forever will be setup. It's the same screen name I use on here. Be ready to have your money taken and a$$ handed to you.

Scion-ce

Wow, first of all you are comparing apples to oranges. As mentioned a hundred times, a turbo kit comes with its own header and intake system. In all fairness, you'd have to compare a stage 0 turbo kit to a s/c kit with an intake and header. Even then, it might be apples to apples but it'd be more like granny smith vs. red delicious. Different taste, different color. You can always add something to make one car faster than the other. Thats not a valid point.

and about the S/C standing for slow crap? You don't want to open that can of worms. Especially because of the fact that your car still breathes as much air as the intake can suck. So take your naturally aspirated a$$ straight to ZPI and get boosted before you started down playing the TRD blower.

Simplyscion

I cant wait to embarass you...how bout this, if I lose, I sell the supercharger and get a ZPI stage 0 kit...and if you lose, you sell your ZPI kit and get a supercharger?? Is it getting more interesting for you yet?? Is there any other stage 0's out there that are close to NY NJ CT or PA?? Honestly, I cant even wait till April cause by then your car will have no shot at all....Emanage, FMIC whatever you need to add to your car playa you can, but like I said, by then I wont even be in your class anymore. For the record once again, Unseens car was fine that day, the car is running as best as it can without engine management, as I know this cause I talk to the kid every other day, the only thing wrong is his car stalls just like everyone else. I would be more than happy to run him from a dig again cause you know what, I will guarantee a win 9 out of 10 times at this point.
Rythmnjoke, be a big boy and get your turbo on already and come on up to the dirty Jerz cause as far as Im concerned...Those that talk ****, dont got **** and this is very apparent here.
Until then, enjoy racing your honda civics, and nissan sentras...I woulda put the hurtin on you with my xB in the quarter

rhythmnsmoke

Lol...I'm not down playing the TRD blower. "Killerxromances" always talking crap about it and he drives an xB(no offense "killer" just giving an example). I didn't hurt your feelings did I? The war is between me and SS, so, no hard feelings aye. I'm just kickin durt at his feet, so don't take it personal that I'm talking about the S/C in a bad way. Any F/I is good F/I IMO. Just keep it real though.

rhythmnsmoke

The only place "Dirty" is the South playa. Don't be a wanna be. And if you are going to be out of my class, then I will just go ahead and bump up to the Stage 1. Still wanna take that ride? And there would be no way in hell I would trade in my ZPI turbo for the S/C. Point being, is that you can't make a S/C into a Stage 1, 2, 3...Or whatever you want to call it. You can change out your pulleys sure...But turbo options are abundant. SimplySqaush's S/C tc will get walked by a N/A tC... Take that crap back to the dealer and tell them you need warranty work done, cause it's not pullin hard enough for you. Or maybe you should try it with the Left Hand...(hidden joke). I don't talk **** because I'm a **** talker. I talk **** because it's fun. And battling you is fun. You talk way more **** than I ever have and ever will. How tall are you? I didn't know they stack **** that high.

I'll race your xB on foot.

Simplyscion

you think a pulley is the only way to make more power on a supercharger?? You are even more stupid and uneducated in the auto world than I thought...I will be waiting, hope your car dont blow up on the ride up here. You ever notice that I NEVER post up pics of my car or list of mods, theres a reason, you will find out if you ever get that turbo...if you order it by april, then lets see,according to my calculations, you should receive it by August. Have a nice day my friend!!
Back on track to the Facts about the supercharger.........

Scion-ce

as we digress... I brought this topic up on another forum and talked to one of the most experienced and most knowledgeable members on that board. Some might know him as lo bux racer. This man knows what he is talking about. This what he had to say about it:

Force Fed raises some interesting points, but without exception, turbo cars make more power without a cat. I've already been down that road with Supras enough times to know that any cat in the way of exhaust after a turbo means less power.

On the other hand, a supercharger, IME, functions just as Corky Bell said. Boost is rpm dependent, and if you blocked off the intake, you'd have marvelous boost but no power. If boost falls, it is because you've removed a restriction. However, there will be no power increase or loss, because boost is related to restriction, not power. There are other issues as well, like intake air temperature (IAT) that really skews boost numbers. If the two situations have different IAT, then we're back to apples and oranges, and the universal gas law tells us that there is no way we have the same IAT, because we have lower pressure, we must have lower temperature. This rule holds true for all gases, from super vacuum to extreme high pressure. So, saying that boost is less with a header just means we've removed a restriction from the system and we haven't changed the rate at which the air is flowing into the engine at all.

AFA the catalytic converter, from a pure performance perspective, every engine I've ever seen makes more power without a cat, assuming it is correctly tuned after the cat is removed. This could mean a lot of things including a cam timing change to take advantage of the more open flow. One of the things that remains constant in all these tests is the economy cam profiles built into the 2AZ. Until someone comes up with a better cam setup, this will continue to be an issue, especially for the NA guys.

What Force Fed is telling me is that they haven't sufficiently tuned the set up without the cats to make it perform its best. I don't believe you need to build a restriction into an exhaust to make an engine perform better. It surely hasn't been my experience over the last 25 years or so.

Stu_Gotti

RACE..RACE..RACE..RAACE..RAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAACE!!!!!!!!.. and by all means.. post some pics and vids.. this outta be good

rhythmnsmoke

of course I know that's not the only way to make power after your S/C install. No, you still have to throw every other mod known to Man to reach 230whp...

PS...I don't order, I go have it installed. When I said April, that was a projected install date, not order date. I'll have something for you though. Hope your car doesn't blow up by that time, seeing as how you have limited Cooling options for your setup.

rhythmnsmoke

Kenny has already called them out on more than one occassions, but they always make up some excuse to scurry away into their little hole.... I SMELL.....KittyKats...

Stu_Gotti

I love it.. especially since one of you would lose.. then when its all said and done... then what.. who ever loses.. what then?

rhythmnsmoke

I will be a man about it. If I loose, I would simple say congrats on the victory. If I would win, I would tell him to kiss my a$$...Heeheee...

Stu_Gotti

Well thats good..

Simplyscion

Wow, another Naive statement from someone who knows nothing other than what others tell him...Come on up to Jersey, bring kenny with you cause we all know that god forbid anything happened to your car on the way up or at the track that you would be in big trouble...then after I fix your car for you, it would be the other way around woudlnt it?? You would be kissing my a$$...cause even though we seem to disagree on every single thing posted up on the forum, Im still a good enough person to help someone out and I think I have proved that time and time again with many people on here...no hard feelings pal, just get that car up and running already...we have one of the best tracks on the East coast, we have been waiting for your guys arrival...theres not kitty kat there my friend.

rimjay2

trd s/c with pulley>zpi stage 0.