Newb question: Will Supercharger work with Auto Transmission?
05-06-2005, 08:13 PM
#1
Member
SL Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: May 2005
Location: Los Angeles, CA
Posts: 59
Newb question: Will Supercharger work with Auto Transmission?
Did a Search and couldn't find an answer to this question, so sorry if it's a re-post and has been beaten to death.
But yea, out of curiosity, will the TRD supercharger work with an automatic transmission?
I don't know much about how they work, so any clarification from more knowledgeable people would be appreciated.
Thanks.
___
But yea, out of curiosity, will the TRD supercharger work with an automatic transmission?
I don't know much about how they work, so any clarification from more knowledgeable people would be appreciated.
Thanks.
___
Last edited by MR_LUV; 06-13-2021 at 07:38 PM. Reason: Awarded 15 Yr Badge
05-06-2005, 08:59 PM
#4
Senior Member
SL Member
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: VA & PA
Posts: 532
Originally Posted by TheQuietThings
yes it will, but the auto tranny won't be able to handle much power after that.
05-06-2005, 09:24 PM
#5
Senior Member
SL Member
Scion Evolution
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: San Antonio, TX
Posts: 359
Originally Posted by Necromancer
Originally Posted by TheQuietThings
yes it will, but the auto tranny won't be able to handle much power after that.
- Desirée
05-06-2005, 09:24 PM
#6
well if you have an automatic, Forced Induction is great on the car, the automatic transmission shifts itself, so theres never a need to take your foot off the gas. If you were to take your foot off the gas, you would lose boost. The more boost you have, the more air your SC or TC is compressing and shoving into your engine. The trade off, is that the stock automatic transmissions can only hold so much power. The stock tC automatic transmission can only handle around 250WHP. Upgrading an automatic transmission can be expensive, and take a long time to install, compared to a manual transmission, which are very easily upgraded and installed.
Also, the automatic transmission has something called a torque converter, which determines when you put down 100% of the power going from the wheels. With an automatic transmission, you can build up boost without moving.
Automatic transmission also lose more power along the drivetrain the manual transmissions lose.
A guideline to follow is that automatic transmissions lose around 18% of the power in the drivetrain and the manual transmissions lose around 11%
Of course with upgraded parts, these numbers can change.
Automatic transmissions are usually noted for being more competitive in drag racing, and manual transmissions are better knowing for their impressive numbers on road courses. The Automatic transmissions normally shifts as soon as you take your foot off the gas, but with a manual, you can stay in any gear that you like.
Hope this helps, if i missed anything let me know.
Also, the automatic transmission has something called a torque converter, which determines when you put down 100% of the power going from the wheels. With an automatic transmission, you can build up boost without moving.
Automatic transmission also lose more power along the drivetrain the manual transmissions lose.
A guideline to follow is that automatic transmissions lose around 18% of the power in the drivetrain and the manual transmissions lose around 11%
Of course with upgraded parts, these numbers can change.
Automatic transmissions are usually noted for being more competitive in drag racing, and manual transmissions are better knowing for their impressive numbers on road courses. The Automatic transmissions normally shifts as soon as you take your foot off the gas, but with a manual, you can stay in any gear that you like.
Hope this helps, if i missed anything let me know.
05-06-2005, 09:39 PM
#7
Senior Member
Scikotics
SL Member
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: Houston, TX
Posts: 990
Originally Posted by TheQuietThings
well if you have an automatic, Forced Induction is great on the car, the automatic transmission shifts itself, so theres never a need to take your foot off the gas. If you were to take your foot off the gas, you would lose boost. The more boost you have, the more air your SC or TC is compressing and shoving into your engine. The trade off, is that the stock automatic transmissions can only hold so much power. The stock tC automatic transmission can only handle around 250WHP. Upgrading an automatic transmission can be expensive, and take a long time to install, compared to a manual transmission, which are very easily upgraded and installed.
Also, the automatic transmission has something called a torque converter, which determines when you put down 100% of the power going from the wheels. With an automatic transmission, you can build up boost without moving.
Automatic transmission also lose more power along the drivetrain the manual transmissions lose.
A guideline to follow is that automatic transmissions lose around 18% of the power in the drivetrain and the manual transmissions lose around 11%
Of course with upgraded parts, these numbers can change.
Automatic transmissions are usually noted for being more competitive in drag racing, and manual transmissions are better knowing for their impressive numbers on road courses. The Automatic transmissions normally shifts as soon as you take your foot off the gas, but with a manual, you can stay in any gear that you like.
Hope this helps, if i missed anything let me know.
Also, the automatic transmission has something called a torque converter, which determines when you put down 100% of the power going from the wheels. With an automatic transmission, you can build up boost without moving.
Automatic transmission also lose more power along the drivetrain the manual transmissions lose.
A guideline to follow is that automatic transmissions lose around 18% of the power in the drivetrain and the manual transmissions lose around 11%
Of course with upgraded parts, these numbers can change.
Automatic transmissions are usually noted for being more competitive in drag racing, and manual transmissions are better knowing for their impressive numbers on road courses. The Automatic transmissions normally shifts as soon as you take your foot off the gas, but with a manual, you can stay in any gear that you like.
Hope this helps, if i missed anything let me know.
05-06-2005, 09:56 PM
#8
Banned
SL Member
Join Date: Feb 2005
Posts: 50
Originally Posted by TheQuietThings
well if you have an automatic, Forced Induction is great on the car, the automatic transmission shifts itself, so theres never a need to take your foot off the gas. If you were to take your foot off the gas, you would lose boost. The more boost you have, the more air your SC or TC is compressing and shoving into your engine. The trade off, is that the stock automatic transmissions can only hold so much power. The stock tC automatic transmission can only handle around 250WHP. Upgrading an automatic transmission can be expensive, and take a long time to install, compared to a manual transmission, which are very easily upgraded and installed.
Also, the automatic transmission has something called a torque converter, which determines when you put down 100% of the power going from the wheels. With an automatic transmission, you can build up boost without moving.
Automatic transmission also lose more power along the drivetrain the manual transmissions lose.
A guideline to follow is that automatic transmissions lose around 18% of the power in the drivetrain and the manual transmissions lose around 11%
Of course with upgraded parts, these numbers can change.
Automatic transmissions are usually noted for being more competitive in drag racing, and manual transmissions are better knowing for their impressive numbers on road courses. The Automatic transmissions normally shifts as soon as you take your foot off the gas, but with a manual, you can stay in any gear that you like.
Hope this helps, if i missed anything let me know.
Also, the automatic transmission has something called a torque converter, which determines when you put down 100% of the power going from the wheels. With an automatic transmission, you can build up boost without moving.
Automatic transmission also lose more power along the drivetrain the manual transmissions lose.
A guideline to follow is that automatic transmissions lose around 18% of the power in the drivetrain and the manual transmissions lose around 11%
Of course with upgraded parts, these numbers can change.
Automatic transmissions are usually noted for being more competitive in drag racing, and manual transmissions are better knowing for their impressive numbers on road courses. The Automatic transmissions normally shifts as soon as you take your foot off the gas, but with a manual, you can stay in any gear that you like.
Hope this helps, if i missed anything let me know.
05-07-2005, 12:31 AM
#11
Senior Member
SL Member
Join Date: Feb 2005
Posts: 2,808
To say the automatic transmission in the tC can only handle up to 250whp is a little ify. For a daily driver, i wouldn't recommend putting that much WHP on an auto unless you have the money to rebuild once it fails.
The TRD supercharger will work with autos, its only rated at roughly 220-230hp which is roughly 205-210whp. That's what TRD is saying, however i disbelieve that the power gains are going to be that high. We are talking about something that is being produced by TRD, and sold by dealerships.
A stock TC dynos in around 140whp, so just for grins lets say with the S/C it puts in 200. That's a 60whp increase, that will probably be more the case. I wouldn't expect anymore than 190-200whp. More than safe.
If you really want to buy something worth the $3,500 you are spending, wait until an aftermarket company produces and puts out something. Rumor has it, GReddy is putting out a Turbo later this year and i think Blitz is possibly testing a supercharger for the Tc? I don't know, its all rumors that I've heard so don't take my words to heart.
For an auto, the safest way to go is all motor. headers, regrind cam, work intervals, CAI or ram air intake, cat back or full custom exhaust, ecu and so on. Just remember, whatever you do, have backup money in case you blow something. Also remember to tune your motor!! If its not tuned, performance parts do nothing.
Good luck!
__________________
The TRD supercharger will work with autos, its only rated at roughly 220-230hp which is roughly 205-210whp. That's what TRD is saying, however i disbelieve that the power gains are going to be that high. We are talking about something that is being produced by TRD, and sold by dealerships.
A stock TC dynos in around 140whp, so just for grins lets say with the S/C it puts in 200. That's a 60whp increase, that will probably be more the case. I wouldn't expect anymore than 190-200whp. More than safe.
If you really want to buy something worth the $3,500 you are spending, wait until an aftermarket company produces and puts out something. Rumor has it, GReddy is putting out a Turbo later this year and i think Blitz is possibly testing a supercharger for the Tc? I don't know, its all rumors that I've heard so don't take my words to heart.
For an auto, the safest way to go is all motor. headers, regrind cam, work intervals, CAI or ram air intake, cat back or full custom exhaust, ecu and so on. Just remember, whatever you do, have backup money in case you blow something. Also remember to tune your motor!! If its not tuned, performance parts do nothing.
Good luck!
__________________
Last edited by MR_LUV; 06-13-2021 at 07:33 PM. Reason: Awarded 15 Yr Badge
05-07-2005, 01:13 AM
#13
Originally Posted by ehong81
so when you add headers or a CAI, does that reduce performance at low RPMs? what would be the best way to improve low-end torque or acceleration?
If you are going to stay NA, i would suggest bigger cams, to allow for more air to get into your engine, high compression pistons, and a short ram air intake, so the air gets to your engine faster.
05-07-2005, 01:16 AM
#15
Originally Posted by killerxromances
For an auto, the safest way to go is all motor. headers, regrind cam, work intervals, cai or ram air intake, cat back or full custom exhaust, ecu and so on. Just remember, whatever you do, have backup money incase you blow something. Also remember to tune your motor!! If its not tuned, performance parts do nothing.
Good luck!
05-07-2005, 02:46 AM
#16
Senior Member
SL Member
Join Date: Feb 2005
Posts: 2,808
^^^
You are absolutely correct. However, overall forced induction is going to put much more stress on any motor vs. all motor. Of course, no matter what you do it will over time cause more stress. from experience and from stories, all motor seems to do the less damage over time.
ehong: 4-1 headers do decrease power in the low-to-mid rpms, however increase and make up difference in the mid-to-high rpms. If you want some more low end, 4-2-1 header is what you want. Gives more low-to-mid power without causing much loss on the high end of your powerband. CAI really won't do much of anything as far as decreasing whp. It just allows the motor to breathe a little easier and runs slightly cooler; in return adds a few whp. Don't expect major whp gains, average for a 2.4 i would say in the range of 3-6whp if the rest of the motor is stock. Of course, if it isn't than you can't really say it added _ amount of hp. For that all the parts together act as one, so all you can really do is estimate and guess unless you choose to dyno.
Bigger cams is a good idea, thats why i said regrind cams. I know for the Xb there aren't any cam upgrades available so i don't know if there are out for the Tc. Time will change that obviously, but regrinding does a very similar effect, and cost less. Everyone has good ideas, so just listen to everyone and choose whats best for you. Or, what your most comfortable with doing.
You are absolutely correct. However, overall forced induction is going to put much more stress on any motor vs. all motor. Of course, no matter what you do it will over time cause more stress. from experience and from stories, all motor seems to do the less damage over time.
ehong: 4-1 headers do decrease power in the low-to-mid rpms, however increase and make up difference in the mid-to-high rpms. If you want some more low end, 4-2-1 header is what you want. Gives more low-to-mid power without causing much loss on the high end of your powerband. CAI really won't do much of anything as far as decreasing whp. It just allows the motor to breathe a little easier and runs slightly cooler; in return adds a few whp. Don't expect major whp gains, average for a 2.4 i would say in the range of 3-6whp if the rest of the motor is stock. Of course, if it isn't than you can't really say it added _ amount of hp. For that all the parts together act as one, so all you can really do is estimate and guess unless you choose to dyno.
Bigger cams is a good idea, thats why i said regrind cams. I know for the Xb there aren't any cam upgrades available so i don't know if there are out for the Tc. Time will change that obviously, but regrinding does a very similar effect, and cost less. Everyone has good ideas, so just listen to everyone and choose whats best for you. Or, what your most comfortable with doing.
05-07-2005, 03:04 AM
#17
Senior Member
SL Member
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: Miami, FL
Posts: 615
"For an auto, the safest way to go is all motor. headers, regrind cam, work intervals, cai or ram air intake, cat back or full custom exhaust, ecu and so on. Just remember, whatever you do, have backup money incase you blow something. Also remember to tune your motor!! If its not tuned, performance parts do nothing. "
Tuning helps the engine produce more horsepower, but your coment "If its not tuned, performance parts do nothing"it is not true ,the stock ECU compensates for increased flow both in and out quite well with fuel mapping adjustments. With out tuning this vehicle has produced in excess of 22hp at the wheels with I,H,E. However i must agree that tuning helps extract more power than otherwise.
Tuning helps the engine produce more horsepower, but your coment "If its not tuned, performance parts do nothing"it is not true ,the stock ECU compensates for increased flow both in and out quite well with fuel mapping adjustments. With out tuning this vehicle has produced in excess of 22hp at the wheels with I,H,E. However i must agree that tuning helps extract more power than otherwise.
05-07-2005, 03:14 AM
#19
Senior Member
SL Member
Join Date: Feb 2005
Posts: 2,808
Originally Posted by acasanova
"For an auto, the safest way to go is all motor. headers, regrind cam, work intervals, cai or ram air intake, cat back or full custom exhaust, ecu and so on. Just remember, whatever you do, have backup money incase you blow something. Also remember to tune your motor!! If its not tuned, performance parts do nothing. "
Tuning helps the engine produce more horsepower, but your coment "If its not tuned, performance parts do nothing"it is not true ,the stock ECU compensates for increased flow both in and out quite well with fuel mapping adjustments. With out tuning this vehicle has produced in excess of 22hp at the wheels with I,H,E. However i must agree that tuning heps extract more power than otherwise.
Tuning helps the engine produce more horsepower, but your coment "If its not tuned, performance parts do nothing"it is not true ,the stock ECU compensates for increased flow both in and out quite well with fuel mapping adjustments. With out tuning this vehicle has produced in excess of 22hp at the wheels with I,H,E. However i must agree that tuning heps extract more power than otherwise.
05-07-2005, 03:17 AM
#20
Member
SL Member
Join Date: May 2005
Location: Tucson, AZ
Posts: 46
Wow, where to start with this one....
First to the extreme novice... superchargers and turbochargers are not transmission specific. The only difference is how well your transmission handles the effects of said part. When you hear about an automatic "not being able to handle the power" usually thats referring to accelerated (sometimes instant) fatal wear to internal parts. Automatic transmissions work a lot like a manual.. they have what are called "clutch packs" which work very similarly to a clutch in a manual transmission. However when you're pushing too much power through an automatic transmission you tend to wear these clutch packs out very quickly. Each gear usually has a clutch pack. Sometimes in like a 4-spd auto 1st and 2nd have their own and 3rd and 4th gears share one. You'll usually burn up the clutch packs in reverse order and lose your high gears first basically the transmission can no longer shift into those geras, requiring a rebuild.
The difference between superchargers and turbochargers is really just how they are driven. A supercharger takes power to make power. An SC is belt driven, so basiclally as your crank pulley turns it spools up the supercharger compressing the air and forcing it through the intake. A turbo on the other hand is spooled by exhaust gas hence the reason it is typically mounted right off of the exhaust manifold. As the RPM's climb and exhaust gas is accelerated it spools the turbo. They both achieve the same effect in the end which is compressing the air and forcing it in (hence, "forced induction").
No matter how you build your engine (naturally aspirated, super/turbo charged, nitrous) you're going to place more stress on your internal engine parts. Building a motor NA you typically will gain power by increasing the motor's ability to intake air, supplying it with more fuel to maintain a stoich air/fuel mixture and increasing the compression (same amt of air/fuel in smaller space (more compressed) creates more force with the same combustion). So the comments about building your engine one way instead of another so you don't have to replace parts is irrelevant.
Newbies beware, working on a car, particularly adding power adders is not for novices, learn more about what you're doing. Building a car isn't like plugging in a toaster.
First to the extreme novice... superchargers and turbochargers are not transmission specific. The only difference is how well your transmission handles the effects of said part. When you hear about an automatic "not being able to handle the power" usually thats referring to accelerated (sometimes instant) fatal wear to internal parts. Automatic transmissions work a lot like a manual.. they have what are called "clutch packs" which work very similarly to a clutch in a manual transmission. However when you're pushing too much power through an automatic transmission you tend to wear these clutch packs out very quickly. Each gear usually has a clutch pack. Sometimes in like a 4-spd auto 1st and 2nd have their own and 3rd and 4th gears share one. You'll usually burn up the clutch packs in reverse order and lose your high gears first basically the transmission can no longer shift into those geras, requiring a rebuild.
The difference between superchargers and turbochargers is really just how they are driven. A supercharger takes power to make power. An SC is belt driven, so basiclally as your crank pulley turns it spools up the supercharger compressing the air and forcing it through the intake. A turbo on the other hand is spooled by exhaust gas hence the reason it is typically mounted right off of the exhaust manifold. As the RPM's climb and exhaust gas is accelerated it spools the turbo. They both achieve the same effect in the end which is compressing the air and forcing it in (hence, "forced induction").
No matter how you build your engine (naturally aspirated, super/turbo charged, nitrous) you're going to place more stress on your internal engine parts. Building a motor NA you typically will gain power by increasing the motor's ability to intake air, supplying it with more fuel to maintain a stoich air/fuel mixture and increasing the compression (same amt of air/fuel in smaller space (more compressed) creates more force with the same combustion). So the comments about building your engine one way instead of another so you don't have to replace parts is irrelevant.
Newbies beware, working on a car, particularly adding power adders is not for novices, learn more about what you're doing. Building a car isn't like plugging in a toaster.