Official Motor Build End-All Super Thread!!!
07-14-2008, 06:25 PM
#21
Senior Member
Music City Scions
Scikotics
SL Member
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: TN
Posts: 16,747
Originally Posted by guttedtc0
we did it with the motor in the car and the car on jackstands in my driveway that is a big butt hill.
If the car had a timing belt instead of a chain it probably would have taken about half the time.
We just took the head and the timing chain cover off and did it like that.
33 miles on it and so far so good
First start we primed it several times.. on about the 6th turn it started.. Let it idle for about a half hour and ive been driving it since. Havent gone over 2500RPMs
Since we took all the mounts and poop off something is vibrating but thats besides this thread
Since we just did it this weekend the whole process is still fresh in my mind.. so if anyone has any questions let me know
and we opted not to remove the balance shafts
If the car had a timing belt instead of a chain it probably would have taken about half the time.
We just took the head and the timing chain cover off and did it like that.
33 miles on it and so far so good
First start we primed it several times.. on about the 6th turn it started.. Let it idle for about a half hour and ive been driving it since. Havent gone over 2500RPMs
Since we took all the mounts and poop off something is vibrating but thats besides this thread
Since we just did it this weekend the whole process is still fresh in my mind.. so if anyone has any questions let me know
and we opted not to remove the balance shafts
I guess my biggest thing is Torque specs. Where did you get the specs for all the bolts and what not?
07-14-2008, 06:34 PM
#22
Senior Member
Music City Scions
Scikotics
SL Member
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: TN
Posts: 16,747
Originally Posted by guttedtc0
forgot to lay it out sorry
K1 Rods $400 from K1
CP Pistons 88.5mm Bore $423 from Race Engineering
Piston Rings $80 from Race Engineering
Cometic Head Gasket $65 from Race Engineering
ARP2000 Head Studs $142 from Ptuning
ACL Bearings $65 from CNS AutoParts on eBay
Had to buy Oil, Filters, Antifreeze/Coolant, Rags.. other small poop
K1 Rods $400 from K1
CP Pistons 88.5mm Bore $423 from Race Engineering
Piston Rings $80 from Race Engineering
Cometic Head Gasket $65 from Race Engineering
ARP2000 Head Studs $142 from Ptuning
ACL Bearings $65 from CNS AutoParts on eBay
Had to buy Oil, Filters, Antifreeze/Coolant, Rags.. other small poop
Man Hours? Thanks for your sources by the way. Picking up pretty much all the same stuff, except the K1 rods. Going with some other rods instead. Probably go with the Manley Performance rods.
07-14-2008, 06:36 PM
#23
Senior Member
SL Member
iTrader: (4)
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: Canoga Park CA, SF Valley
Posts: 2,727
Originally Posted by rhythmnsmoke
Originally Posted by gwtc
Originally Posted by rhythmnsmoke
Originally Posted by gwtc
As far as I know, this is one of few that has a motor built that's still up and running, his name is Garm(scionlife name: tc4fun4me), I think it was done about 2 years ago, the crazy thing is he uses it as his daily driver, it dyno at: 443 whp, 474 torque @ 22 pounds of boost, the car is at a body shop right now getting a complete exterior makeover. Here's a link to his website: http://www.sciontcx.com/index.html, it has most of the info you need about the car, you can always contact him by email to ask him about the motor built.
Brian (Jester), don't come to SL but every once in a full moon. Fully built top and bottom, Hydra standalone... 542whp.
But yeah, I remembered Garm making a thread when he dynoed it. Took that 443whp to the track and ran like a high 13 sec low 14sec in the 1/4 mile....Don't ask.
Yeah, it's running the Turbonetics GTK 550 turbo, with a custom manifold built and tuned partly at ZPI and then transfered down to Turbochargers.com where they finished up. I can't remember, but it's reving to like 7k+ rpm.
07-14-2008, 07:03 PM
#26
Senior Member
SL Member
iTrader: (4)
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: Canoga Park CA, SF Valley
Posts: 2,727
Originally Posted by rhythmnsmoke
^^I only want 480 - 500 myself. Want to be more Time Attack than drag, and I think that range is sufficient enough to be very good competition.
07-14-2008, 07:12 PM
#27
Senior Member
Music City Scions
Scikotics
SL Member
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: TN
Posts: 16,747
Originally Posted by gwtc
Originally Posted by rhythmnsmoke
^^I only want 480 - 500 myself. Want to be more Time Attack than drag, and I think that range is sufficient enough to be very good competition.
07-14-2008, 10:11 PM
#29
Senior Member
SL Member
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: Rock Hill, SC
Posts: 397
one MAJOR concern i haven't heard talk about here yet that anyone building an engine, especially a high HP engine, should be paying TONS of attention to should be your oil clearances. You can't just slap an engine together an expect to crank out 500+whp without a hitch. With a turbo you really want to run your main and rod bearing on the looser side. I'm in no way an expert but my clearances (main and rod) will be within .0019"-.0020"
As far as I know some if not most scion race team are using about the same. Also don't forget to check you thrust clearances since you will be running a much stronger clutch. As well as the ring gaps, they are just as important.
I have access to the online shop manuals for all years. Just ask.
As far as I know some if not most scion race team are using about the same. Also don't forget to check you thrust clearances since you will be running a much stronger clutch. As well as the ring gaps, they are just as important.
I have access to the online shop manuals for all years. Just ask.
07-14-2008, 10:12 PM
#30
Senior Member
Music City Scions
Scikotics
SL Member
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: TN
Posts: 16,747
Yeah, I think we will be pulling the motor out. Talked to my boy and I mentioned about doing it in the car and talking about removing the timing chain and cover. His reaction......"That would be a b!tch though"....lol
07-14-2008, 10:42 PM
#31
Banned
SL Member
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: NJ
Posts: 65
doing it in the car was a _____.. but taking out the axles and tranny was also
hardest part was the timing chain cover.. just because every bolt is a few inches away from the frame.. We unbolted all the mounts and moved the motor whichever way we needed
Rhythymn.. I have a distributor account at Race.. so let me know if u need anything.. thats where my prices were from
I had an ALLDATA printout of head gasket and engine overhaul. Rod bolts and Head Studs came with their own torque specs. Only other thing that needed to be torqued was the camshaft caps which are 18 and 22 for the cam gear caps. There werent any torque specs on the balance shaft so we just tightened em sufficiently.. nothing crazy
89mm Headgasket
I was gonna go with the Manley Rods.. but The guys from PR made 500+ without a problem with the K1's.. so I figured I would save $300
any other questions let me know
hardest part was the timing chain cover.. just because every bolt is a few inches away from the frame.. We unbolted all the mounts and moved the motor whichever way we needed
Rhythymn.. I have a distributor account at Race.. so let me know if u need anything.. thats where my prices were from
I had an ALLDATA printout of head gasket and engine overhaul. Rod bolts and Head Studs came with their own torque specs. Only other thing that needed to be torqued was the camshaft caps which are 18 and 22 for the cam gear caps. There werent any torque specs on the balance shaft so we just tightened em sufficiently.. nothing crazy
89mm Headgasket
I was gonna go with the Manley Rods.. but The guys from PR made 500+ without a problem with the K1's.. so I figured I would save $300
any other questions let me know
07-14-2008, 10:58 PM
#32
Senior Member
SL Member
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Blue Springs, MO
Posts: 2,184
did you use plastigauge to check all of your bearing clearances or did you just slap them in?? I have access to alldata as well, that is what I will be using for specs. during my build. anyone have info on the stroker kit coming out from crower? I never can find info on that. I know it can be made to order, for a measly 4k 
.
.
07-14-2008, 11:05 PM
#33
Senior Member
Music City Scions
Scikotics
SL Member
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: TN
Posts: 16,747
Originally Posted by guttedtc0
doing it in the car was a biscuit.. but taking out the axles and tranny was also
hardest part was the timing chain cover.. just because every bolt is a few inches away from the frame.. We unbolted all the mounts and moved the motor whichever way we needed
Rhythymn.. I have a distributor account at Race.. so let me know if u need anything.. thats where my prices were from
I had an ALLDATA printout of head gasket and engine overhaul. Rod bolts and Head Studs came with their own torque specs. Only other thing that needed to be torqued was the camshaft caps which are 18 and 22 for the cam gear caps. There werent any torque specs on the balance shaft so we just tightened em sufficiently.. nothing crazy
89mm Headgasket
I was gonna go with the Manley Rods.. but The guys from PR made 500+ without a problem with the K1's.. so I figured I would save $300
any other questions let me know
hardest part was the timing chain cover.. just because every bolt is a few inches away from the frame.. We unbolted all the mounts and moved the motor whichever way we needed
Rhythymn.. I have a distributor account at Race.. so let me know if u need anything.. thats where my prices were from
I had an ALLDATA printout of head gasket and engine overhaul. Rod bolts and Head Studs came with their own torque specs. Only other thing that needed to be torqued was the camshaft caps which are 18 and 22 for the cam gear caps. There werent any torque specs on the balance shaft so we just tightened em sufficiently.. nothing crazy
89mm Headgasket
I was gonna go with the Manley Rods.. but The guys from PR made 500+ without a problem with the K1's.. so I figured I would save $300
any other questions let me know
I've torn the axles and tranny out about 6 times thus far (on my car about 3 or 4 times alone), so I can do that part in my sleep....lol. Even did it by myself one time. This week I'm about to help my boy take out his tranny.
Yeah the K1's seem to be popular for their pricing and what not. The Manley Rods are rated up to 1,000hp, so I figured I could never go wrong with those...lol. Plus they look beefy as hell.
What is alldata, and how do one go about getting their hands on it? Over on the other thread, Ptuning was mentioning about honing the block and what not. Not sure if that's needed if you are going to be sleeving the motor.
***edit....I just googled ALLDATA and found the site
07-14-2008, 11:26 PM
#34
Senior Member
Music City Scions
Scikotics
SL Member
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: TN
Posts: 16,747
This is the part I was talking with PTuning over on the other thread (about their main/head studs).
They wrote:
I guess a lot of that has to do with if you are going to be sleeving the block.
They wrote:
The final engine assembly and gapping the rings can be done by you but obviously, machining the block and setting the bearing clearance should be done by your machinist, since you may need to polished the crank to achieve the desire oil clearances for all the journals. If you're running our ptuning main studs or install sleeves, your machine shop will also need to align honed your main caps. Also final honing on the block should be performed with a torque plate and if you're running our ptuning head studs, they should be installed and torque to the proper spec before honing.
I guess a lot of that has to do with if you are going to be sleeving the block.
07-14-2008, 11:49 PM
#35
Senior Member
SL Member
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Blue Springs, MO
Posts: 2,184
basically align honing is to make all of your clearances on your main bearing journals the same, the block is bolted down and a long cylinder with cutting edges machines all of your bearing journals to the same clearances. Hard to describe with words but I have seen it done in person, pretty cool. All of that should be done whether you are getting your block sleeved or not, it is an important part of any engine build. You don't want your bearing clearances off.
07-15-2008, 12:01 AM
#37
Senior Member
Music City Scions
Scikotics
SL Member
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: TN
Posts: 16,747
Originally Posted by t_urbo_C_harged
basically align honing is to make all of your clearances on your main bearing journals the same, the block is bolted down and a long cylinder with cutting edges machines all of your bearing journals to the same clearances. Hard to describe with words but I have seen it done in person, pretty cool. All of that should be done whether you are getting your block sleeved or not, it is an important part of any engine build. You don't want your bearing clearances off.
Yeah, that's what Ptuning said in the other thread. So, not skippin on that part. Any idea a general round about price on getting it honed?
**edit, I just did some searching, and found the average prices out. Not to bad. From the looks of it, I'm at least going to get the block honed and decked.
07-15-2008, 05:16 PM
#39
Senior Member
SL Member
Scion Evolution
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: Motor City
Posts: 2,860
Originally Posted by Bryan06tC
Rythmn I actually have a service manual on disc I can get to ya.... but dont tell anyone :-)..... all the procedures, torque specs on every bolt on the motor, etc.
What are the odds of me getting a copy of that?