rhythmnsmoke

What details are you looking for. This dyno is very old, so it would be hard pressed to find ALL the details about it. And We are aware that the GT series turbos make 500whp, but again, we are talking built motors.

All I'm trying to say, is that I'm liking the move toward big turbos and equal manifolds. My concern for you is that sales might exactly be that great because of the small ability to BUY that's in the Scion community. Most of the kids (yes Kids), have low budgets and looking for only near 300whp. So, it's just a warning for you if you try to tap into this market, thinking it will sell greatly. For competition and sales sake, you might want to find a smaller turbo, price it accordingly, and run two kits, one for Non-built motors (street performers) and Built Motors (Sub 10sec cars).

zer0

BS Alert!!
Turbochargers.com has some false advertising going on..
Even ZPI says it is a GT30 that was used for that dyno...
http://www.zeropointindustries.net/f...highlight=gt30

rhythmnsmoke

^^Good find Zero. I didn't look it up myself.

Either way though, 16G's can and will make 380-400whp.

Guru

Yes but I have a dyno chart to back up my claim. I need to see proof in the puddin. Sure this GT37 can also make 500 WHP but is that on pump fuel? No not at all. I have no doubt that a 16G can make more than 300 WHP but the argument here is that it can do so at moderate levels on a stock Tc motor on pump 93 octane fuel with no high EGT's or detonation. So far I have not seen it but I could be wrong. Anyone have a dyno chart and specifics? Your point is taken Rythmsmoke but as I said, we scrapped the 16G project quite some time ago and will not be producing it at all. I'm sure there will be other manufactured you can get something like that from if you desire a 16G. Why the fascination with a 16G I'm not sure. Only DSM guys seem to like it much it seems mostly due to low cost. They are quite cheap yes and work okay on a 2.0 liter DSM but the Tc is a very different motor with much greater displacement and much longer stroke.

paul_dezod

Was that done with a downshift or on an auto?

rhythmnsmoke

I gave you a vid, did you not watch it?

trdtcpr

watching!

Joe_Dezod

EGTs go up as boost goes up. 14psi will always have higher EGTs than 10 psi regardless of how much you try to compensate by tuning. Air becomes hotter as it's compressed more. Physics baby!

+1 Guru on that battle lol.

paul_dezod

EGTs are HEAVILY dependent upon AFR of the vehicle and VE of the chambers.

Guru

Also as you can see on that chart whatever chart that is that torque is under 300 ft lbs at 4000 RPM as opposed to over 330 ft lbs on our kit. On the other end of the spectrum that chart is making less than 300 ft lbs at 5500 RPM whereas our kit is making 312ish ft lbs at the same RPM. What does that mean? A broader torque curve, more area under the curve, broader powerband and faster car.

paul_dezod

To play devil's advocate, despite me proclaiming neurtrality, Dyno variations and atmospheric conditions can play a role as well in the acclaimed numbers. Unless we get both cars in the same area, tuned to the same power levels, on the same octane, same dyno and yadda yadda, this is boarderline to a ____ing match at best.

I think a heads up race is in order to resolve.

zer0

Episode of Pinks plz. Jackie vs Travis

turbo27

http://www.roadraceengineering.com/eclturbos.htm

"This turbo is made by Mitsubishi Heavy Industries. The TDO5-16G with the 7 cm exhaust housing will hold over 20 pounds of boost if you ask it to. If you promise to keep the boost down you can use the stock fuel system other than an upgraded fuel pump. To use it's full potential however, you will need at least 550cc injectors and some form of electronics to control them (Apex AFC). The stock 1G turbo flows 405 cfm vs. the 16G at 505 cfm. With the proper porting of the exhaust manifold, Turbo, and O2 sensor housing, you will hardly notice any increased lag. You will however feel tons of top end power!

This is the stock turbo from the Lancer EVO III. Outwardly they look like any other 16G. They use the same compressor housing, TDO-5 exhaust wheel, and the same 7cm volume exhaust housing. Until you pop off the compressor housing... HELLO! Big Wheel. Flows 550 cfm vs. 505 cfm for the regular 16G.

The normal 16-G compressor wheel is 1.83" at the inducer and 2.36" at the exducer. The Big 16-G is 1.89" at the inducer and 2.68" at the exducer. That is just over 5/16" (8mm) larger than the normal 16-G exducer and the same size as the GReddy 18-G (inducer diameter is only .10" smaller than a 18-G). "

http://www.dsmparts.com/customer/pro...&cat=129&page=

"This is a must have if you are upgrading your DSM Turbo. This is one of the rarest turbos on the planet and can push out 400+ HP easily. The turbine outlet on this turbo is 2.5" on the EVO III and only 2.0" on our Big 16G DSM Turbo. This is a true MHI (Mitsubishi Heavy Industries) turbo. "

Guru

Well very true Paul. I'm doing a general comparison. But even if you look at the chart in the video posted which I believe is a 16G turbo anything over 3200 RPM the torque is greater on our kit and of course also at high RPM. Only at very low RPM's is there a torque advantage on the 16G I THINK since I have not run across a chart that begins their run below the one I saw on that video which I think may be a bit skewed.

turbo27

Guru, I guess we really need to try this out lol. In the summer if I hopefully get my kit together Ill come up there and do some tuning. After that we'll test out the cars and record videos. We'll compare the turbos first hand. I feel like we started a little battle and I had no intentions in doing that but yea hopefully we'll meet up. What kind of videos are you going to be putting up? Think you can get one of a dyno and possibly a 1/4 mile run?

Guru

I'm not putting the car back on the dyno but I can do a full 1-4th gear run if you like.

turbo27

Yea that would be sweet if you could get a vid showing the tach and going 1-4th. I wanna see how the RPMs jump. What do you guys spin the tires through? Im guessing atleast 1st and 2nd?

rhythmnsmoke

Meeh...I'm not one to debate with paper #'s. Lay down some rubber already so we can see how the thing performs. I would like for you guys to come to the Shoot Out too. The dates are somewhere around July 14th I believe. Will have to check on that.

Guru

Well at the moment the car is running stock wheels and tires since up until Monday we did have snow here. I HOPE Spring is here in Michigan. I have not had the opportunity to drive the car hard around town. I went with her on the highway but we were doing 3rd and 4th gear pulls to confirm boost levels and make sure everything is safe. No problems at all.

yamaha16bw

Ive learn so much be reading this thread!


Keep up the great work Dan! Its nice to have people like paul, joe and now dan to help us all out.