Uyles

Alright guys, I'm gonna start installing a system in a few weeks here, but I'm kind of torn on what equipment to buy.

As of right now, for the front, I'm thinking of:

6-1/2" Type-R 2-way Car Speakers (for the front speakers)

5-1/4" 2-way Type-R Series Speakers (for back speakers)

I have no ideas what tweeters to go with, and I don't know what type of amp I would need to power these speakers.
Any help with that would be extremely helpful.
Also, if you have any suggestions on better speaker components for the front cab of the car, please help me out. (Headunit suggestions would be awesome too).

As for the back:

2x 12" Type-R

Kenwood KAC-9104D Monoblock (1,800 watt max)
OR
Power Acoustik BAMF-2000/1D (2,000 watt max)

Either amps would power the subs at 2ohms.
I've heard nothing bad about the Kenwood, but I've heard simply nothing about the Power Acoustik.
There is always the option of having two amps for two subs, but I'm not sure on what amps would be good for that situation.

I've also failed at finding subwoofers better than the Type-R's for that price.
I've heard multiple good things about JL's, but I'm not quite sure how much those would cost.
If anybody has had experience with both, or just one of the options, please share.
I'm open to any and all suggestions.

Enclosures is another issue.
I was thinking of going with Q-Logic's Vented 12" Sub Enclosure, but I have heard of people having problems with it, and to be honest, I'm not quite sure how it would look.

Floor mounting is something I'd prefer to go with because I love the look of it, but once again, I'm not sure of the pricing of it.

So essentially, I'm just looking for any soundsystem equipment suggestions/help.
I tried to be as specific as I could, to show you guys what I'm thinking of doing (price and equipment wise), rather than asking some blank question like "wut amp/sub should i get, lolz."

Thank you in advance for any help you give me!
(Sorry for the terribly large post,

Uyles

To the top!

kidwolf908

First of all, what kind of system are you looking for? Do you just want to get LOUD? Do you want it to be a very sound quality-oriented system? Or do you want a mix of both (SQL)? Would you like a more stealthy setup (hidden amps, hidden subs even)?

Just some points right off the bat, if you don't care about your rear passengers having their own dedicated speakers, don't run them at all. Having rear speakers in addition to front speakers alters your imaging and is absolutely unnecessary, especially when you're running a sub in the trunk.

In addition, MUCH better subwoofers can be had for the same price as the Type-R's, as well as better components than the Type-R components (especially if you scrap the rear speakers and can add the cash from them to the front components).

Get back to me on the above specifications and we can help you out even further!

Uyles

Alright, well, I'm look for SQL.

I'd like to show both the amps and the subs off, but have them floor mounted.
The best example I can give of how I would want my setup to look would be something along the lines of this (I don't remember whose car this is, sorry):





Do you, or does anyone know how much roughly that whole setup would cost?

As for the rear speakers, I never really thought about that.
I won't have multiple people in my car, so I do guess they would be a bit unneccessary.
So, you're saying I should cut the rear speakers and use that cash to by better front components? That does make sense.

I have no idea where to start looking for subwoofers around the price of the Type-R's. If you're kind enough, could you possibly list two or three?
The reason I chose Type-R's is because I've heard nothing really bad about them, and multiple other subs I was looking at were a bit pricey.

Thank you so much for the help. As you can see, I'm kind of new to this stuff.
17 year old kid, first car, you know how it goes.

kidwolf908

**Lot of reading, just fyi**

Don't worry man, I totally understand, I was in the same position a year and a half ago with my tC. I just did a butt load of research like you are doing now lol

Unfortunately, that setup would REQUIRE you to delete the spare tire, which means if you get a flat, you damn sure better have AAA or you're screwed. I would personally never go that route. If you wanted a flashy install, they make fiberglass enclosures specific for the tC that go in the corners of the trunk near the tails. Can paint them any color you like too. And if you go this route, you could build (or have built) a nice amp rack to go up near the rear seats to show off your setup.

And yes, I'm suggesting you definitely scrap the rear speakers if you don't have people in the back often, or even if you do all the time. I only run fronts and my system sounds almost as good from the back as it does from the front seats. Since you'd like to have the setup shown off, having two amps that are made by the same manufacturer in the same series would be the best idea. One two channel for your front components and one mono for your sub(s).

Which brings us to another point, what head unit are you using? If this is centered around the stock Scion head unit, you're going to either need some line-out converters, or invest in an aftermarket unit (best idea).

The only reason anyone will say you can find better subs for the money over the Type-R's is because they are mostly intended to just get loud without being very articulate or smoothly integrated with the front stage.

In the same price range, the Dayton HO offers much improved sound quality, articulation, and detail. The 12" HO is only about $10 more than the 12" Type-R. Other options include the Resonant Engineering SE12 for about $30 more than the Type-R. You might also want to consider a single 15" subwoofer, I've always thought a single 15 would look much cleaner and cooler than dual-12's and will definitely be more than enough sounds for you. Since we have hatchbacks, it is VERY easy to get the sub loud, my single 10" makes my nuts vibrate in the front seat without much effort at all lol

How much do you have to spend on your whole setup btw?

Uyles

So, something along the lines of this would be more practical? (once again, don't know who's car this is. Sorry!):



I'm planning on buying everything together, or as close together as possible.

The two head units I'm looking at are the:
Pioneer DEH-P500UB
and the:
Alpine CDA-9884
Fairly simple, I know, but I don't want to be spending a whole lot. (Those would fit in the tC, right? )
Any other options I should be pursuing?

As for a two-channel amp for the front components, which would be a good option? I have absolutely no idea where to start for that.

As for a monoblock amp, either of the two amps I listed in my original post should be enough power to run 2 12"s correct?
I'm not sure if they'd be enough to power a 15" though.

Money-wise, I'd like to around $1,000-ish going a little bit over is alright, and probably expected. (I would include installation in that price, but I don't know how much installation would run, and I'm obviously not a DIY'er).

BZinn1

I am building something along the ines of the last picture you posted.

Just a heads up the boxes are $400 a pair before shipping.
I am putting a pair of Image Dynamics D2s in them and they luckily cost me under $200 for 3 of them gently used.
My amp is the Elemental Designs NINe.5 that is powering my subs and my components...that was $300
Wiring to do every thing was another $175
Sound deadening was another $200

I still have to pick up some plexi,MDF,suede for another $200 easy.

All that still does not include the AVIC and all the controls I got for it which was about another $800

So if you plan on building a stealthy setup like the last one it can get spendy fast.

Get good subs and good components mandatory......rear stage is not needed and very hard to install and get it to work with the front stage and sound good....
Good amp is a must as is a good deck.

So far I am at about a year into my build as I am kinda poor and could not afford to do it all at once.

First I bought the AVIC,then the wiring and comps,then the amp,then the subs,then the boxes.It sounds really good and clear and loud as can be....won't win any contests but it is good quality materials that make the diffearnce.

BZinn1

Also it is good to buy your amps a little over powered for what you are gonna power up.that way you are not pushing the map all the way to power something and you get a cleaner signal and better sound.Also it is expandable for the future.

Over time you will change components and subs and it is nice not to have to buy new amps each time you expand.

Uyles

What site are you getting your boxes shipped from?

I was actually looking at the Elemental Designs NINe.1 Amplifier a little bit ago, and it seems unless I can find something better than that, that's going to be the way I'm going to for for my subwoofer's power.
Any other amps?

I still don't quite know where to start for the component's power, though. Would the NINe.1 power the components I want too, or should I still get a seperate amp?

And yes, now I'm torn on whether I want two 12"s in fiberglass boxes along the sides, or one 15" fiberglassed in the middle.

Should I spend more money and get a bomb-___ head unit, or stick with the cheaper one? A more expensive one will obviously sound better and give me more power, so eh.
Everyone who has a nice soundsystem generally has something along the lines of an AVIC.

I apologize for all of the questions, but I'm just trying to get things straightened out before I go on and shell out $1,000+.

kidwolf908

As far as the head unit, either one of those is a perfectly fine option and will be a great fit in the tC as long as you get the dash kit and wiring harnesses.

However, a monoblock has the ability to be every bit as effective running a single 15" as running dual-12's. Dual 12's, depending on model, might actually require more power than a single 15". As far as amplifiers go, a good two channel with at least 75wRMS per channel will do you fine, and a monoblock that puts out at least 500wRMS at 2ohms should suffice. Word of advice though, stay away from Power Akoustik, they are not of high quality.

For amps, go with a reputable brand as they are the most important part of your system (excluding the head unit). Pioneer, Alpine, Kenwood, JL, Kicker, Rockford, Infinity, Memphis, Sundown, etc. For great components on a budget, check out the Pioneer Premier TSD720C's. They're available on ebay for $115. A quality 2 channel amp (for example, Alpine MRP-F250, 2x 100RMS) will run you about $120 as well from Crutchfield, which is actually a great deal for them. A great monoblock (for example, Alpine MRP-M500, 1x 500RMS @ 2 ohms) will be about $150 off eBay.

A nice 15" sub will run you about $140-175, and a pair of 12's about $250-300 so the single 15 might be a more viable option. The RE SE15 is a sick 15 with 600wRMS power handling, so the M500 will be a perfect match.

You'll also have to buy wiring for your amps and speakers. A 4AWG 4-channel wiring kit + distribution block and extra ground wire for your second amp will run you about $70.

A pre-fabricated subwoofer box will, more than likely, be less than optimal for the sound you want. Having a custom box, specifically built and tuned for your selected sub would be the best route. A custom box will cost you about $75-100 depending on size and if the builder has to ship it to you.

The head unit + dash kit + harnesses will run you about $150 from Crutchfield right now for the CDA9884.

Add installation, depending on who does the job, you're looking at about $1100 I would say. The system components themselves will run you about $900.

Of course, there are an INNUMERABLE amount of different options for front speakers, subs, amps, etc. However, the final decision comes down to you and your research (or opinions you've gathered).

Should I spend more money and get a bomb-butt head unit, or stick with the cheaper one? A more expensive one will obviously sound better and give me more power, so eh.
Everyone who has a nice soundsystem generally has something along the lines of an AVIC.

This is not true at all. A more expensive head unit has zero effect on the power seen by your speakers and sub(s). The head unit is merely a source unit to provide your amplifiers with the signal THEY need to amplify. In addition, an AVIC is a decent head unit, but is nowhere near audiophile-grade when you are looking for an all-out SQ-system. The signal that the CDA9884 or DEH5000UB will provide will be every bit as good as what ANY AVIC provides. The only advantage the AVIC has over the two aforementioned units is navigation and DVD playback. If you're talking about serious high-end units, you must look to ones like the Eclipse 7200mkII, Alpine 9887, Premier 800PRS, Clarion DRZ9255. In addition, ANY subwoofer box you buy to have shipped to you should not cost more than $150 shipped if it's just a carpeted MDF box. Paying $300 for a box is insane and whoever bought that got ripped off. Build the box yourself or with a friend that knows how to do woodworking. I'll design the box for you and give you dimensions based on what sub you decide on.

Uyles

So, after all of this information you've given me, I'm looking at this.
Any other opinions or options would be awesome, but this is what I'm looking at based on your extremely helpful feedback

Amplifier:
For subwoofer: Alpine MRP-M650
For components: Alpine MRP-F250

Head Unit:
Alpine CDA-9884 (with dash kit/harnesses).

Components*:
Pioneer Premier TS-D720C
OR
Alpine SPR-17S
OR
Well, uh...essentially any other good components?

Subwoofer(s)*:
12" Type-R Subwoofer x2.
OR
RE SE15 (I know nothing about this sub, is there any way I could get information or a detailed link regarding this one?)
OR
Well, uh...essentially any other good subwoofers? (I know a lot of people have Kickers.)

Could I get a link to the 4AWG 4-channel wiring kit, perhaps?

Did not put add a box in here, because I'm still unsure about it.
Fiberglass? Carpet? Floor Mounted? I don't know.

(NOTE: The titles with marked with an * are options I am unsure about. Any further feedback would be awesome.)

BZinn1

Check the Elemential Designs new Comps they have coming out http://www.edesignaudio.com/product_...roducts_id=617

NINe.1 is a beast of an amp.the nice thing about ED products are there are a lot of differant ways you can use them,they hold differant ohm loads very well and are goign to give a good clean sound.

With subs goto a few differant stores and check out how differant subs sound.Get some good ideas,and bring your own music to test them with so you can hear songs you are gonna be listening to.

the sub boxes I have are from Bassforms.com http://www.bassforms.com/ProductDeta...ctCode=BF210TC

great boxes,but i had a 5 week wait to get them,as the manufacturer kept sending them only left hand boxes

Also a great sub I heard this year are the Boston 12"
http://www.crutchfield.com/p_065G510...ston+sub&tp=13

Buy one get one free.They work really well with the passive radiators,painfully loud and they move a lot of air.

another great sub that hits really hard and has great SQ is the Image Dynamics IDMAX.

shop around. and try to find a amp that pushes at least 100w a channel to each of the front speakers without being maxed out that way you get a good clean signal and maximum volume.....same withthe sub amp.

BZinn1

Also.......deaden the car....all body panels,floor boards,hatch....makes a big differance in how it sounds.

Uyles

That link you gave me was to a 10".
That seems like a good deal.

Would that be worth it?

kidwolf908

IDMAX's are expensive, definitely out of his price range. The better option would be the IDQv4.

The complete 4AWG wiring kit can be found here, great brand and cables: http://knukonceptz.com/productDetail...rodID=KOL-AK44

And you would use this distribution block: http://www.knukonceptz.com/productDe...?prodID=KNF-12

As far as the RE SE goes, here's a link to RE's website and an ebay link to buy one:
http://reaudio.com/specs.html (SE is 3/4 down the page)

http://cgi.ebay.com/RE-AUDIO-SE15-15-CAR-STEREO-SUB-WOOFER-SE15D4-SE-15-D4_W0QQitemZ400007941875QQcmdZViewItemQQptZCar_Subwoofers_Enclosures?hash=item400007941875&_trksid=p3286.c0.m14&_trkparms=72%3A1205|66%3A2|65%3A12|39%3A1|240%3A1318

And for custom built boxes, check out these guys: http://www.woodlawncabinetry.com/

In addition, over on caraudio.com, you can find PLENTY of members willing to build and ship a box to you. I've done business with a member named vitveet over there and he builds great boxes for the money! I'm also considering building custom boxes for people over the winter break.

If you're looking to save money and still be loud and clean, go with the single 15 or even a single 12 if you aren't looking to get super loud. Running dual 12's requires more power, and a larger more expensive box.

As far as components go, there are a BUNCH more options, but you have to determine how much the rest of your build will cost before you can figure out which component set to go with based on how much money you have left. The Pioneer set is DEFINITELY better than the Type-R components though. Phoenix Gold RSD's are an awesome set for the $90 shipped that they are as well, I run them and love them... though I will be upgrading soon, they're an awesome starter set.

Any other questions, feel completely free to PM me or keep it coming in here

Uyles

I'll shoot you questions on here, so other people can chime in if they want.
You've been such a help, I can't thank you enough.

So, if you had to choose between Phoenix Gold RSd 65cs's and Pioneer Premier TS-D720C's, which would you choose?
Disregard prices, the $20-ish difference isn't huge for me.
The Pioneer's seem to have much more power than the Phoenix Gold's do, but if you're running the Gold's and you like them, then I suppose your opinion will be slightly biased.

http://www.woodlawncabinetry.com/ is apparently shut down until 2009, I just went to their site.

The RE SE subwoofer seems to go perfect with that Alpine MRP-M650 amplifier.

I'm trying to go for good looks when I get the box too, matching the black/silver interior.

UNiT_xEr0

if your gonna power your RE's with a alpine go higher in watts. trust me i know i have the RE XXX and RE SX and when i tried to power the SX with the 650 is was weak. i would look at different amps. somehow alpine grew away from me

UNiT_xEr0

this is my setup with the RE SX powered by Arc Audio FD1200.1. i think its higher but i'll check tomorrow. and my audio guys said i'm still under powering the SX's and when i have the XXX's in they are way way underpowered. theres a alpine amp that they ran and made sound insanely good i'll ask them on it on saturday

kidwolf908

That's a great idea on the box color scheme. You could wrap it in black and grey carpet or black and silver vinyl and it would look friggin nice. Between the RSD's and the Pioneer's, I would probably try the Pioneers simply because I haven't owned them myself yet. However, I've heard great things about them from a LOT of people. On the other hand though, I've heard just as many rave reviews about the RSD's for the money and they're even acclaimed at Car Audio and Electronics Magazine, check out the review: http://www.caraudiomag.com/testrepor...5cs/index.html

The Pioneer's, however, do NOT have more power than the RSD's. Both sets have a 60wRMS power handling per side. Don't be misled, the RSD's get CRAZY loud, even passive, as will the Pioneer's.

It's unfortunate that Woodlawn is shut down, they made some very quality boxes for decent prices. Also checkout Fisher Customs too, they're a tad more pricey, but they will do a custom carpeting or paint job for you however you like!

kidwolf908

Unit Xero: you're running SX's. They have a power handling of 1000RMS, while your XXX's have a power handling of 2000RMS, of course you'd be underpowering them with 650 watts...

The SE's on the other hand have a power handling of 600wRMS, which the M500 or 650 would match beautifully. If the OP wishes to go big on the sub power, the Kicker ZX750.1 is another awesome option, which will put out in the area of 850wRMS at 2 ohms, which will blow him out of the car with the 15" SE. The 750.1 can be found on ebay for about $250 BNIB. Pair it with a Kicker ZX200.4 ($135) or a 350.4 ($170) bridged for his front components and that system will be slick, sound great, and have a buttload of power!