Al-Truistic

--- would we get better power? I understand that bigger pipes give more flow out of the engine through the exhaust but, wouldn't we get some performance gain from mandrel/smoother bent stock piping instead of the crimp(?) bends that are from the factory? And wouldn't better flowing mandrel bent stock piping produce a gain (probably slight, but still a gain :D ) and not alot of noise?

Would this be easy for a custom shop to produce? Not too expensive?

Just wondering because aftermarket always seems to produce more sound (not necessarily bad) but for me, just looking for better performance not fastest, is a better goal.

elwood58

A custom shop can do this, but at that point you might as well get a bigger pipe. Many shops may not stock the 1.75" pipe.

If it is the noise of performance exhaust you are worried about, many shops can install silencers for you that will make it fairly quiet without giving up all of the performance gains.

Al-Truistic

Thanks!

So, mandrel bends aren't enough to help?

Silencers are in the end pipe, or can they be put in all along the piping? I've heard there is something called a resonator where is this in relation to the silencer and does it do the same thing? There is a mean throbbing kind of hum sound that comes out from high revving that I notice every now and then, more in the cabin than outside...

Is your cat-back mandrel bent and did it fit with the stock header or is the cat-back pipe bigger than the stock header?

Could a shop just mandrel bend the stock pipe that is already there? I'm mostly asking for a possible project I might try...still in the planning stages.

Al.Truistic
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chucksu

I would say for some gains, sense I take it your not going to want to red line each gear to fill it, go for a 2" System. If its possible run it from the manifold back.

http://www.justmagnaflow.com/Catalyt...ters/53000.htm (New Cat #CARK 53064)
http://www.justmagnaflow.com/Univers...Aluminized.htm (Round muffler aka resenator just look for 2" in/out not sure how long you can fit under there.)
http://www.justmagnaflow.com/Univers...Aluminized.htm (The muffler.)
If all this is set up right & all you should get some more power along with a nice sound but nothing that is to loud.

its_ikon

there is a place in bakersfiled or victorville can do mandrel bent piping, but i don't remember the cost. cars at the factory come with small piping. using slightly bigger pipping along with them being mandrel bent will free up some horsepower.

elwood58

You cannot bend the existing pipe as it has already been crimped. Smooth corners on the inside are what give you the performance hit.

My Cat Back is Mandrel Bent, and was installed just behind the Oxygen sensor. There is a transition from 1.75" to 2.25" with a clamp. I had my guy cut and weld everything. Unless you plan to install a header, just do the Cat Back. There is not enough length between the exhaust manifold and Cat to worry about.

The resonator goes between the Cat and Muffler as a means of tuning the tone of the exhaust. Thinks of it as the "Exhasut Note", as in a musical scale. A Silencer gets installed at the muffler end as a way of controling the Volume of the Exhaust Note. Sound Volume as apposed to area volume/flow.

Keep in mind that anything you add to the system other than a large straight pipe is going to cause some restriction. Your ECU will adjust to whatever you decide.

Guest

remeber Al, that bigger pipes means more noise. And I remember when you were wonering about the noise levels on the hills of frisco too. More flow means more noise in our cars, just becareful. :D

fireballfish

Bigger pipe DOES NOT mean more noise nessessarily. I could go up to a 2.5" pipe, and put 2 or 3 resonators and a dual pass muffler and be QUIETER than stock.

Al-Truistic

Can you explain what a dual pass muffler is? Thanks!

Al.Truistic
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Guest

ok lets look at what you said, " I am going to add bigger pipe to my scion but before the muffler I am going to add 2 to 3 resinators."
Thats not relevant to what I was saying, I was implying that using the stock set-up with bigger pipe may cause more noise. I didn't say you could not quiet it down, please read the post before you answer. here we go again.

And yes I want to hear your definition of a "dual pass muffler" please.

Al-Truistic

Do they make a polished stainless steel stock/1.75 inch auto axle with my tip Gabe :?:

Al.Truistic
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elwood58

Is the GURU of Scion Exhaust! Just order up whatever he tells you to order up. If you are near him, take your car to his shop. You could have purchased a whole new exhaust by now if your time is worth anything!

fireballfish

How is it not relevant to what was said? How do you intend to "use the stock setup" if you're changing the pipe diameter? were you infering that he would use the stock muffler? if so, the dB would NOT go up and you would have to bottleneck the exhaust to make it fit the stock muffler. A dual pass muffler is really 2 mufflers in one unit, the exhaust enters one end, goes through 2 (or more) baffled sections prior to exiting to the tail pipe. most "high performance" mufflers are a "straight through" design vice "dual pass"

Al-Truistic

No worries, I know of the Stylis and PrecisionMuffler mystique and the legend that is Scion Central.

So, Stylis what is a dual pass muffler and is a mandrel bent replacement stock system just too outrageously expensive to even consider?

Al.Truistic
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fireballfish

I've seen Kitsap muffler sell complete catbacks for about $400. For my money I'm going to get one from a company who's used a dyno to design theirs... If I were you since you don't want the additional sound, I would stick with your stock system. If you want a cooler looking tip, have one welded (or bolted ) in. most of the performance exhaust systems are louder, and only make maybe 5 HP near redline. If you get the K&N intake, you get a dyno proven 8hp... you will get more noise from your engine bay, but less than a performance exhaust would add

Guest

actually I sold al truistic an axle back and he asked for a different tip already, I bet kit sappy exhaust is not going to install a tip that you want. I take care of scionlife people and answer all of their questions, besides I don't make a cat back system to sell, maganflow has the best catback over everyone. I sell axle backs and manifold back systems(dyno tested) The manifold back system is 500.00 and will beat out any cat back ever made. But you wouldn't know anything about that would you. Hope your satisfied with the cat back

Al-Truistic

Thanks Stylis again for the great exhaust.
I have to say an exhaust really is one of the nicer things anyone can do to thier ride to raise the style of it. And there is none better than PrecisionMuffler and Gabe's service (---and stories!) to get the job done.

This post is all about getting a discussion going and maybe some info flowing on what and if a mandrel bent stock exhaust system is something to be looked into. I'm thinking it is not the worst thing you can do and regardless of 1.75 or 2.25 inch size pipe better flow is better flow.

Congrats on the recent win Gabe!

Al.Truistic
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Thanks fireballfish! Much appreciated. The quest (or at least the questions) continue... Kitsap is in Washington State, no? I used to have a girlfriend a long time ago from Gig Harbor, WA...

Al.Truistic
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fireballfish

No problem... it's always nice to get an opinion from more than one source. I know I'd really like to see a dyno "shoot out" for the 2nz-fe. I'll probably go for the 5zigen cat back ( I'll weld my own pipe from the header to the catback, and not use a cat... see if that helps any) Yeah, Kitsap is in WA, Gig harbor is only 20 minutes south of me... small world. want to hear something even crazier? I bought a 1992 camaro in DeBary FL before I joined the navy, then I got stationed in WA... I was going through the papers in the car after being stationed in WA, and low and behold the car was originally from where I got stationed... cross country twice!

2fixA

did you mean the xA/xB engine, 1nz-fe? shoot out for the exhaust? after the intake shoot out and the ruckus that caused who knows if anyone would attempt it...

from what I've seen dyno wise Gabe's manifold back coupled to a performance intake will give you just around or over 8 horsepower to the wheels... and don't mind his sniping, he's had to deal with quite a few lately..

that's crazy about your car crossing country...

fireballfish

OOPS! yeah I meant the 1nz-fe... So 8HP to the wheels? Wow, that's a bit more than I expected. Is that on a stock car or did it have other mods? I want to get an intake (K&N) and Exhaust (5zigen???) but I'm getting ready to transfer to VA. After I transfer it'll be a totally different situation. I'm not doubting anyone's exhaust isn't "good", but for the dollar I'm very partial to the 5zigen.