What are the Scion advantages over the Ford Focus?
06-15-2005, 03:15 PM
#61
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Originally Posted by mytcbaby
Just cause its and old saying doesn't mean it isn't true. My dad gets a brand new ford taurus every 2 years for free. The problem is, they rarely make it to 2 years without falling apart. He has had about 5 or 6 taruses and he is so fed up that when I got my Scion he decided he wanted me to keep my truck so when the car breaks he can drive it... btw the truck is a TOYOTA tacoma and is 4 years older than his 2005. Weve never had a problem with any toyota we have had, we have had nothing but problems with every Ford... so don't say I haven't had experience. The only I will ever buy that is Ford is the Diesel trucks... and we happen to have one that we haven't had problems with yet 
but we just got it and its brand new. You can't say Im not informed on the matter. Plain and simple I love the USA but every American car we have owned has had problems (except the ford truck but its only a few months old), euro cars weve had, better than american but vw is going downhill... asian going strong in this family. just my .02 centsi bet that if i treat a scion as maybe your dad threats his taurus it will fall apart too...
you need to give your car certain amount of atention + care...otherwise it will just fall apart...no matter the brand...
why dont your dad spend his money on a ford to see how good they are...
as i said early...my brother had a celica...and it was on the shop every month...
and celica = toyota...
06-15-2005, 03:29 PM
#62
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Originally Posted by mytcbaby
Originally Posted by SVT4ME
Believe it or not Toyota has made some pretty crappy cars too. I don't see too many people proud of their Echo. Or their ancient early-'80's Tercel hatchback (they're not even on the road anymore, I haven't seen one in years - I wonder why).
Ford did fix the Taurus, they got rid of it and replaced it with the Five Hundred.
06-15-2005, 03:37 PM
#63
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Originally Posted by mytcbaby
Originally Posted by SVT4ME
Believe it or not Toyota has made some pretty crappy cars too. I don't see too many people proud of their Echo. Or their ancient early-'80's Tercel hatchback (they're not even on the road anymore, I haven't seen one in years - I wonder why).
during the 80's and early 90's the american brands just starte to make crapy cars...
and now people think ALL the american cars are crap...
and thats not true...
newer fords (i dont know about other brands) cars are not like that....they are as reliable as any from japan
06-15-2005, 04:00 PM
#65
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Originally Posted by pio
This is the problem with the american cars...
during the 80's and early 90's the american brands just starte to make crapy cars...
and now people think ALL the american cars are crap...
and thats not true...
newer fords (i dont know about other brands) cars are not like that....they are as reliable as any from japan
during the 80's and early 90's the american brands just starte to make crapy cars...
and now people think ALL the american cars are crap...
and thats not true...
newer fords (i dont know about other brands) cars are not like that....they are as reliable as any from japan
June 13, 2005: Ford recalls 260,000 SUV's & trucks
http://msnbc.msn.com/id/8203875/
Mar 23, 2005: NHTSA investigates Ford over cruise control fires
http://msnbc.msn.com/id/7277061/
Feb 7, 2005: Ford recalls over 350,000 Focus vehicles
http://msnbc.msn.com/id/6924436/
Dec 27, 2004: Ford recalls another 310,000 compact SUV's
http://msnbc.msn.com/id/6758468/
Dec 13, 2004: Ford recalls 600,000 compact SUV's
http://msnbc.msn.com/id/6758468/
Sep 10, 2004: Ford recalls 230,00 Econoline vans for ABS fires
http://msnbc.msn.com/id/5960907/
That's 6 recalls since September for all 2000-2005 model years, still think Ford is building a better vehicle?
06-15-2005, 04:06 PM
#66
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The bottom line is the fact the ScionLife is PRO Toyota. I don't think that thier is a member on SL with over 400 post, that would not swear by a Toyota.
The bottom line:
Open up a Consumer Reports auto issue. Look at how many Ford are reccomended,
THEN look at how many Toyota are reccomended!
There are 6 out of 14 Fords recomended, and 15/16 TOYOTA's are reccomended.
Do you think I make this stuff up?
TOYOTA > ford!
The bottom line:
Open up a Consumer Reports auto issue. Look at how many Ford are reccomended,
THEN look at how many Toyota are reccomended!
There are 6 out of 14 Fords recomended, and 15/16 TOYOTA's are reccomended.
Do you think I make this stuff up?
TOYOTA > ford!
06-15-2005, 04:19 PM
#67
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Interestingly enough, if you search "Toyota recalls" you'll find TOYOTA HAS RECALLS TOO! Recent ones! Wow imagine that. Unfortunately for the apparently brainwashed public (who seem to think Toyota is "unsinkable") Toyota recalls don't get the media blasting like Ford, GM, or Chrysler recalls get. Every time an American car company has even the most minor recall, it gets tons of media attention. Meanwhile it appears there are plenty of recalls on '05 model Toyotas (including one on the Avalon that sounds like a major safety hazard) but I never would have known - where's the media to announce those?
06-15-2005, 05:24 PM
#68
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god, these "All fords suck" or "all Japanese cars rock" posts are just retarted. A coworker had a Taco and needed the entire tranny replaced within 30k miles, and 2 other friends had the Frontier from a year or two ago and had a TON of problems pretty much from Day 1. I also had a 1995 Jeep (Just Empty Every Pocket) that went for 140k miles with almost zero problems. And the 1995 jeeps were supposedly a bad year for jeeps...
to answer the original poster, I looked briefly at the Focus before getting the tC, and it's definitely a step down in interior quality and horsepower/tq, as well as standard features. Flip side is that they're cheaper, as Ford currently has a 2500 rebate on Focuses (Focii?) and can probably be bargained down even further. So you're really comparing a 16k car with a 13k car. Big difference. This also helps both for and against the quicker depreciation, as if you get the 16k car for 13k, when its worth 9 in a couple years it's a lot easier to take than when you pay 16k for a car and it's worth 9k in a couple years. All depends on what you pay for it originally.
as for performance, the main problem with the tC is that its heavy, and set up relatively soft out of the box so it feels even heavier. stiffer/lower springs help, but the focus is 250lbs lighter so FI of any kind is going to have more of an impact. in initial testing the tC has proved relatively receptive to tuning, and apparantly can put out about 300hp on stock internals. Overall, though, it feels much more like a mini-Lexus (especially right off the lot) than a high-RPM screaming race car. It's got creature comforts like panoramic moonroof, nice stereo, stock power everything, AC, etc.
Hope this helps, I'm still lovin' mine after 7 months, 14k miles, although getting the itch to upgrade. Intake/Exhaust and Springs/Shocks/Sway bar are probably as far as I'll go, though. Maybe a short shifter, too...
to answer the original poster, I looked briefly at the Focus before getting the tC, and it's definitely a step down in interior quality and horsepower/tq, as well as standard features. Flip side is that they're cheaper, as Ford currently has a 2500 rebate on Focuses (Focii?) and can probably be bargained down even further. So you're really comparing a 16k car with a 13k car. Big difference. This also helps both for and against the quicker depreciation, as if you get the 16k car for 13k, when its worth 9 in a couple years it's a lot easier to take than when you pay 16k for a car and it's worth 9k in a couple years. All depends on what you pay for it originally.
as for performance, the main problem with the tC is that its heavy, and set up relatively soft out of the box so it feels even heavier. stiffer/lower springs help, but the focus is 250lbs lighter so FI of any kind is going to have more of an impact. in initial testing the tC has proved relatively receptive to tuning, and apparantly can put out about 300hp on stock internals. Overall, though, it feels much more like a mini-Lexus (especially right off the lot) than a high-RPM screaming race car. It's got creature comforts like panoramic moonroof, nice stereo, stock power everything, AC, etc.
Hope this helps, I'm still lovin' mine after 7 months, 14k miles, although getting the itch to upgrade. Intake/Exhaust and Springs/Shocks/Sway bar are probably as far as I'll go, though. Maybe a short shifter, too...
06-15-2005, 05:25 PM
#69
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OK I'll bite, SVT4ME. I never said Toyota never had recalls, every manufactuer does BUT I only see 3 in the same time frame for things like faulty steering column(only 4,600 Avalons produced in Kentucky), a suspension problem that MIGHT hinder steering(750,000 Trucks and SUV's) and a problem with day-time running lamps (90,000 Celicas).
I would gladly take those problems aside from my vehicle setting on fire, having my brakes fail, having a door fly open or having a fuel line on my diesel engine pop loose causing another fire!
Toyota's recalls are few and relatively minor while Ford's are plentiful and catastrophic. Oh I also forgot, Ford had 2 or 3 recalls already on their brand new supercar, the GT, one where the upper control arms could break!
But whatever, this is my final post on this subject. No one will ever get me to buy a Ford again. I've owned 2 and both were complete money pits.
I would gladly take those problems aside from my vehicle setting on fire, having my brakes fail, having a door fly open or having a fuel line on my diesel engine pop loose causing another fire!
Toyota's recalls are few and relatively minor while Ford's are plentiful and catastrophic. Oh I also forgot, Ford had 2 or 3 recalls already on their brand new supercar, the GT, one where the upper control arms could break!
But whatever, this is my final post on this subject. No one will ever get me to buy a Ford again. I've owned 2 and both were complete money pits.
06-15-2005, 05:37 PM
#70
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Originally Posted by SVT4ME
Interestingly enough, if you search "Toyota recalls" you'll find TOYOTA HAS RECALLS TOO! Recent ones! Wow imagine that. Unfortunately for the apparently brainwashed public (who seem to think Toyota is "unsinkable") Toyota recalls don't get the media blasting like Ford, GM, or Chrysler recalls get. Every time an American car company has even the most minor recall, it gets tons of media attention. Meanwhile it appears there are plenty of recalls on '05 model Toyotas (including one on the Avalon that sounds like a major safety hazard) but I never would have known - where's the media to announce those?
No one said that Toyota does not have recalls. But it is a known fact that Toyota has substantially less than Ford. And unlike Ford, Toyota does not have to offer $4000 rebates to sell their cars! There is a reason why the Camry is America’s #1 selling car, and not the almost dead Taurus!
I am PROUD that my xB was made in Japan by a Toyota worker.
You keep driving around in your Focus buddy, and let me know when your suspension starts creaking, your power steering starts leaking, and when your fuel pump quits pumping! These are all documented problems of the Ford Focus. And when you keep getting recalls (on a already recalled items) don’t say I told you so!
06-15-2005, 05:39 PM
#71
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Originally Posted by jmiller20874
But whatever, this is my final post on this subject. No one will ever get me to buy a Ford again. I've owned 2 and both were complete money pits.
06-15-2005, 05:51 PM
#72
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06-15-2005, 06:09 PM
#73
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Originally Posted by UnFocused
Originally Posted by SVT4ME
Interestingly enough, if you search "Toyota recalls" you'll find TOYOTA HAS RECALLS TOO! Recent ones! Wow imagine that. Unfortunately for the apparently brainwashed public (who seem to think Toyota is "unsinkable") Toyota recalls don't get the media blasting like Ford, GM, or Chrysler recalls get. Every time an American car company has even the most minor recall, it gets tons of media attention. Meanwhile it appears there are plenty of recalls on '05 model Toyotas (including one on the Avalon that sounds like a major safety hazard) but I never would have known - where's the media to announce those?
No one said that Toyota does not have recalls. But it is a known fact that Toyota has substantially less than Ford. And unlike Ford, Toyota does not have to offer $4000 rebates to sell their cars! There is a reason why the Camry is America’s #1 selling car, and not the almost dead Taurus!
I am PROUD that my xB was made in Japan by a Toyota worker.
You keep driving around in your Focus buddy, and let me know when your suspension starts creaking, your power steering starts leaking, and when your fuel pump quits pumping! These are all documented problems of the Ford Focus. And when you keep getting recalls (on a already recalled items) don’t say I told you so!
And for the record it should be fairly obvious by my screen name that I drive an SVT Focus. I did apparently misspeak earlier when I said that model has had no recalls. It has had one, issued when the car was first released. None since then. So contrary to your uninformed opinion, my car is not a recall-riddled crap pile. As I stated earlier and apparently need to state again, the BULK of the recalls were for the 2000/2001 model year. The recent models (2002+) have been low on the "recall count" which shows that Ford has made improvement. But no one cares about that, they all want to fixate on the fact that the early cars had a lot of recalls.
06-15-2005, 06:18 PM
#74
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You guys need to look at things in a relative way, it's not all black and white. Reliability is all about chances. When you say "Toyota makes reliable cars" it does not mean that are you guaranteed, upon buying a Toyota vehicle, a 100% problem free ownership. What it does mean is that on average, your typical Toyota, will most likely prove to be a relatively reliable car, especially when compared to other cars from competitors. This, in reverse, does not mean that every Ford will fall apart.
Toyota IS more reliable than Ford. What this means is that: your average Toyota, driven by your average driver, maintained with the typical consistency, will provide, on average, a more trouble-free experience when compared to an identically used Ford. It's not about certainty, it's about probability.
Toyota IS more reliable than Ford. What this means is that: your average Toyota, driven by your average driver, maintained with the typical consistency, will provide, on average, a more trouble-free experience when compared to an identically used Ford. It's not about certainty, it's about probability.
06-15-2005, 06:35 PM
#75
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It is very obvious that many people in the world are trading their Chevy's and Fords for Toyotas, why else would Toyota be steadily gaining on Chevy's number one spot. There is a reason Chevy is falling from their top spot, just as there is a reason that Ford is not #1. There is also a reason that Toyota has had record setting years lately and is setting its sights on being the number one automaker. If Fords were better than Toyotas, then they would be #1 or even #2 for that matter. And hey, guess what, your on a SCION forum so dont even try to tell us that you dont like Toyota. If you dont like Toyota then what are you doing here?
06-15-2005, 06:45 PM
#76
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Originally Posted by dmikon
You guys need to look at things in a relative way, it's not all black and white. Reliability is all about chances. When you say "Toyota makes reliable cars" it does not mean that are you guaranteed, upon buying a Toyota vehicle, a 100% problem free ownership. What it does mean is that on average, your typical Toyota, will most likely prove to be a relatively reliable car, especially when compared to other cars from competitors. This, in reverse, does not mean that every Ford will fall apart.
Toyota IS more reliable than Ford. What this means is that: your average Toyota, driven by your average driver, maintained with the typical consistency, will provide, on average, a more trouble-free experience when compared to an identically used Ford. It's not about certainty, it's about probability.
Toyota IS more reliable than Ford. What this means is that: your average Toyota, driven by your average driver, maintained with the typical consistency, will provide, on average, a more trouble-free experience when compared to an identically used Ford. It's not about certainty, it's about probability.
but neither svt4me or i have said otherwise...
toyota have a great reputation and ford is building thir own...years after they lost it...
problem is that while people in forums like this keep telling other how "creap" the focus is people will not belive how good they reallly are...
just ask the focus owners...
06-15-2005, 07:01 PM
#77
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Can't say I'm surprised to see people dump on a Ford on a Toyota messageboard. They dump on other cars over at Focaljet too.
I liked my SVT, got bored with it and got the TC. Its a little "nicer" than the SVT. Its slower. It doesn't handle nearly as well. It doesn't have a 6 speed. You can't get leather factory. It does have a cooler roof. It has a little less of an economy car rep.
SVT Focuses were all made in Mexico, so I didn't feel any better or worse for buying it vs. a Japanese made Scion.
I sold the SVT to my father in law, who was looking for a small car that was good on gas. He likes it so far.
Its been very reliable.
I liked my SVT, got bored with it and got the TC. Its a little "nicer" than the SVT. Its slower. It doesn't handle nearly as well. It doesn't have a 6 speed. You can't get leather factory. It does have a cooler roof. It has a little less of an economy car rep.
SVT Focuses were all made in Mexico, so I didn't feel any better or worse for buying it vs. a Japanese made Scion.
I sold the SVT to my father in law, who was looking for a small car that was good on gas. He likes it so far.
Its been very reliable.
06-15-2005, 07:07 PM
#78
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Hey all you Ford lover out there here is a little tip....
I you are tired of all the Ford bashing then GO TO A FORD FORUM!!!!
Remember where you are at "SCION LIFE" where Scion is our life! Jeez would you like some cheese with your whine!
I you are tired of all the Ford bashing then GO TO A FORD FORUM!!!!
Remember where you are at "SCION LIFE" where Scion is our life! Jeez would you like some cheese with your whine!
06-15-2005, 08:14 PM
#79
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mytcbaby who are you talking to? Me? I never said I don't like Toyota. That's the whole point! I think it's lame that you guys are giving him crap for having a Focus and making fun of the Focus and Ford. I came here to correct some inaccuracies and give a little insight in favor of the Focus, WITHOUT just throwing around stupid insults about Toyota or Scion, you know, trying to have an actual discussion - and all I get in return is more comments about how Ford sucks and I'm a Toyota-hater.
Apparently some of you don't understand the notion of competition in the marketplace? Things will only be "right with the world" when Toyota is the only auto manufacturer left?
Apparently some of you don't understand the notion of competition in the marketplace? Things will only be "right with the world" when Toyota is the only auto manufacturer left?
06-15-2005, 08:19 PM
#80
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Originally Posted by SILVERtC_LOVR
Hey all you Ford lover out there here is a little tip....
I you are tired of all the Ford bashing then GO TO A FORD FORUM!!!!
Remember where you are at "SCION LIFE" where Scion is our life! Jeez would you like some cheese with your whine!
I you are tired of all the Ford bashing then GO TO A FORD FORUM!!!!
Remember where you are at "SCION LIFE" where Scion is our life! Jeez would you like some cheese with your whine!