Aztcrs801

So like NST, Agency Power had also made a lightweight crank pulley for the tC1. They have now also done the same with the tC2. I have been running the pulley for a little while now with no problems and very similar results in improvements just like NST's pulley, more response, freed up power and even more found torque. The pulley weight difference was dramatic when holding the both stock and AP pulley(almost 4.5lbs vs just under 1.2lbs). Looks amazing and works just as well. I highly recommend this pulley to all if you have not upgraded or tried the NST option. Should be on sale very very soon on the market on Agency Power's website. and for an idea on the design,it looks a lot like the new FR-S pulley http://www.agency-power.com/blog/age...-crank-pulley/. find some lost power free it up with a lightweight crank pulley!

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Brichard0625

Nice find..i see perrin has one too but im a little disappointed that they dont put it up dyno results like nst

2tCornot2tC

That link is for the FR-S...

Aztcrs801

OKay not to get off topic i posted the link bc thats what it looks like, the Tc2 pulley is not officially released yet but will be very soon. I know about the link i just used it for reference. to stay on topic this is a Tc2 pulley for the Tc2 that im running and has similar results to the Nst variant.

2tCornot2tC

What kind of aluminum is yours made out of?

Aztcrs801

2Tc always so technical but of course the finest aluminium for this application some good 6061 aircraft grade aluminum cnc machined. Great improvement over the stock beastly heavy pulley

2tCornot2tC

6061-T651 is absolutely the worst aluminum there is as far as strength goes. Its only use if you need to weld to it. Every other property of that aluminum was compromised to have weldability. And I don’t think that you ever plan to weld on it as a pulley. Why does everybody in the automotive industry go with 6061-T6? Just about any other aluminum you choose will be twice as strong – that means that you could have made it half the weight it is right now and be just as strong had you mode it out of some other grade! NST uses 6061 and I told them they had made the wrong decision also. 6061 has the same designation and is graded the same way as aircraft grade aluminum but is only used for decorative purposes in an aircraft…trim items in the interior that will be gold plated or bent into funky shapes to make a decoration. It is not allowed to be used as a load bearing member in an aircraft…it would not be able to take off if the whole airplane was made out of that junk. I would have chosen 2024-T351…although 7075-T6 is even stronger.

speterson82

so i was thinking, why do so many car manufacturers use 6061 if it's not good enough for automotive applications. I found this experiment by Clemson University testing this very question. I'm not an engineer, but from the looks of it, 6061 will be just fine....maybe you can elaborate on why this is not the case.
http://www.clemson.edu/manufacturing...%25202010b.pdf

2tCornot2tC

Read...it's all in the abstract...getting the surface finish at super high manufacturing speeds. Are you building 1000 of these an hour? Not an ounce of that junk is used on any aircraft...structurally.

speterson82

no, its not all in the abstract...read the whole thing

2tCornot2tC

OK...it was written for a freshman engineering student...so what. What in the article impressed you...since we are going off topic here?

speterson82

what I'm trying to get at (as is elaborated on in the test) is that 6061 is widely used in automotive applications for several reasons alluded to in the experiment. I get that it isn't for a commercial airliner. What I want you to explain to us is why its not good enough for car parts...namely the pulley. We aren't subjecting our cars to near the stresses of an airplane, so how does it matter if airplanes don't use it. Although 6061 isn't the strongest alloy, overkill isn't necessary. It sounds like all the features of 6061 make it more than good enough for this application, but if you can explain why it isn't, I would be interested to know the issues.

2tCornot2tC

Your biggest enemy in any vehicle (be it an aircraft or an automobile) is weight, weight and weight (also the primary subject in your article)…and if you think that parts on your car aren’t stressed as high on your car as they are on an aircraft, then you’ve got a lot to learn and I’m wasting my time with you. I’ve said it in this thread (read!) and others, that you can make it half the weight and still be as strong if made from any other alloy, but then you can only machine 100/hour instead of 1000/hour. How many are you going to make for the performance industry? …and get double the performance!

speterson82

see, you're still dodging it. Sure you can make other alloys weigh less and be stronger, that's not the point. The point is why 6061 T6 isn't strong enough for a car's crank pulley. So you can answer this by explaining what the tensile and other related strengths are of 6061 and elaborate on how the forces on the pulley demand more strength than that. The part only needs to be as good as the application calls for. If the pulley only really needs a material as strong as 6061, why would they use a more expensive alloy. If 6061 isn't good enough in this application, than actually explain why. Oh and certain parts can be stressed as much as other certain aircraft parts, if that is the case with the crank than share that as well.

Cal3000

We will just have to put this material to the test. A lot of people are testing the NST product for longevity right now. We'll see what the results are sooner or later. Has any failures occurred over at the tc1 boards from these pulleys? NST have been making them for a while now.

Aztcrs801

Speterson82 thanks for the insight. 2tc, you guys are taking this too critical. The reason for 6061 is because this is not a plane 6061 is decently light and stong enough for the application. If other stonger alloys would be used It could be a little lighter but the majority of weight has already been shed. No need for overkill. Also the main idea is to sell this to masses and to keep pricing resonable to the majority of people. You can design an even more hightech pulley id try it it'd be top engineering but how many could be sold to people willing to pay more to make any profit. Its like this to be competetive. Like the veyron, engineering marvel but not so affordable to the masses. This thread is to promtote a new product not threadjack and argue.

speterson82

No argument here. I value 2tc's input, if something is wrong with the materials for the application, I'd like to know. But sometimes you have to coax specifics out of him. But, at this point I have a feeling that 6061 Is good enough for the pulley.

Aztcrs801

Same I learn alot of tech from 2tc he always tries to seek ways for engineering improvements as a critic, from the business point 6061 is plenty good enough for this appilication and affordable. I haven't heard of much failures from nst nor ap and shows that 6061 is good enough to meet tolerances. The stronger alloys would be awesome and slight improvents but also more costly. Like scions they're meant to be affordable and also reliable. So to the guys that don't have the nst pulley, here is a secondary option for a good improvement, AP's lightweight crank pulley(releasing soon)

2tCornot2tC

Look, your stock pulley is good enough right now…it is working right now…is it not? It has not failed…has it? Then why are you changing it? Oh, Oh, Oh, I know…I know…I know! You want better performance. And how did you get this added performance? By putting on a lighter pulley… sound familiar? There is no price difference between 6061-T6 and 2024-T3…they both cost the same per pound. A custom shop machining these parts will machine them both at the same feed rates. SO, please help me out! Where is the cost penalty for using 2024-T3? All NST did was make a direct copy of the OEM pulley and saved weight from the differences in densities of the two materials alone. Here is a different design (at least from the photos) and the potential to really save weight (means greater performance here guys…starting to catch on?) if engineered. Choosing the right material is just one of the steps…

Aztcrs801

2tc, next time im up at the shop I will run that by them and ask. I will def bring it up and see what they say. And yes the pulley look the same as the one in the pic only differce is the center keyslot thing where mounted. I will def discuss the idea with them. 2tc you should start up a shop for machining, 2Tc tuning haha. I do see your points and will discuss it soon.