xA is a great car, but you're gonna be hard pressed to find another car stock w/ alloys, cruise, 6 airbags, 200w 6-speaker stereo, very flexible seating/cargo space, mileage, and excellent driving dynamics for the $15,120 that the 5MT Fit Sport costs. I wouldn't have traded my xB in if I didn't seriously feel I was getting more car for the money. That having been said, I am interested in seeing how Scion responds with it's upcoming releases in the next few years. Scion's become like an ex-girlfriend to me now -- I'm ridin' something new, but still can't forget what I left behind.

 

Of course, sometimes it comes down to which you prefer. I prefer toyotas to hondas and always have. So that's a factor in the decision just as much as the money for a lot of people.

I'd like to know where you left out the door with a fit sport for the same price as I left with my xA. That has to be without tax, title, license, document, since MSRP for a MT fit sport is $15,170. That's $2390 more than the MT xA- lotta price for an extra gear, cruise, and alloy wheels. Considering I left the dealership in my AT xA for $15,120, there's no way you could get out the door in a manual fit for less than $16k at this time, since they're going for MSRP.

Just thought I'd point out that they're not a good comparison price wise...one is almost $2500 more. Which means you'd obviously get more stuff...IF you were willing to spend the cash.


ETA: Actually, that $2390 extra only buys you cruise and the "magic seats." Alloys are an extra $850 on the fit. So...i'd say they're not truly comparable, pricing wise.

 

But, if this guy truly believes that the fit is a much better car for the same money and felt he could save her from making a terrible mistake.. then it would have been wrong not to say something IMO.

Reading his posts, my guess is his real motivation was because he's a know it all type and his wanting to feel superior was his motivation, but lets pretend that's not the case.

Why is it inappropriate to interrupt (what you believe to be) someone getting ripped off? How? We, as a society, don't owe the people that are trying to make their living by taking our money in anyway. Think of all the times you buy something and YOU say "thank you" and how often do they not?

Another thing she ^^^, the 18 year old, is going to wipe the floor with me in this discussion, I know it already AND, check it out, she (you) quoted me as a sig. That was a funny quote, I thought. I always wanted to be quoted as a sig, thank you.

 

a "terrible mistake?" it's HER CAR. Not his. Clearly she likes it and would not be so desperately unhappy with it so as to have it ruin her life for the next five years, just because there is a similar honda out there. Honestly. It is only his opinion that she is making a "terrible mistake" and that still doesn't make it ok to interfere in someone's personal business.

The reason it's wrong to interrupt someone you feel is getting ripped off is because it's NOT YOUR BUSINESS. If I get ripped off, it doesn't impact you in any way, and clearly if I thought i was getting taken i wouldn't be purchasing. So I'm at least reasonably comfortable with my choice, and it's not your business or place to offer YOUR opinion on the deal I am making.

I just find it impossibly rude for someone to approach, clearly indicate he was listening in on a deal I was making, and interfere in something that I probably spent a lot of time thinking over and deciding on. To come into that situation and offer an unsolicited opinion is inappropriate.

there are times when one must learn to simply keep their mouth shut even when they feel they should be involved in a situation- her terrible mistake is simply none of his business, and the world would have kept on spinning if he hadn't been at the dealership that day and she'd walked out with the keys to her xA. Now, if she had been purchasing a car he knew was say, loaded with high explosives, THAT would be a dire mistake.

In the grand scheme of mistakes, purchasing a toyota when someone else in the room believes that hondas are all anyone should ever buy is not a big mistake...it's a personal choice. Part of maturity is understanding what is a choice (potentially a bad one) and what is a mistake. They are not necessarily the same.

you're welcome for the signature, btw. I couldn't let that one go!

 

Well it wont hurt her if she goes to check out the fit first. She would probably glad the guy told her about it when she decides to get that instead. As for the salesman, there was no need for that kind of language.

 

ok, How about this.

I was looking at a house and became aware, after some investigation, evidence of cronic water problems in the live in basement. As I walked out of the house, another couple was walking in, with their agent, and I warned the wife to "check closely in the basement for water damage". Was that wrong?

 

I'd look upon that differently, as that is [for the most part] being a good samaritan.

Now, if you saw a couple looking at a house with a realtor across the street from your house for sale, and you went over and budged in on the viewing while the realtor was distracted... I think that would be a situation that is more closely related to the Fit situation being discussed.

Just simply advising them on a potential problem isn't wrong. What's wrong is that he had no place bringing his unsolicited opinions to that Toyota dealer when he had nothing but the fact that he's a Fit fanboi backing his cause.

 

Yeah, preference often does play a big part in a decision. Ultimately, in my case, I wanted the better handling/performance of the Fit over my xB in the end. I could have got a tC, but then I would have given up the utility of the xB and gained a sunroof, which I hate.

And you're right -- $15,120 was the price they gave me before fees, tax, etc. and was $50 less then MSRP, which is excellent considering many Fits are being sold now with a high markup. Anyway, out the door was $16,265, so actually only about $1,150 more than you paid in the end. Realistically, however, it's not fair to compare a base xA to a Fit Sport, as the Sport is a premium grade and naturally has a higher price due to the extra equipment. The base Fit is a much better match and has an MSRP only $530 higher than the xA. However, xA has no side air bags std. like the Fit, so to make it an even comparison you have to add them to the xA, which is a $650 option and now brings the xA $120 over the price of the base Fit, and you still don't get the extra cargo space the Fit has and more flexible seating. You also don't get a somewhat more powerful engine, much quicker steering, a 2ft tighter turning radius, lower cargo floor, A/C filter, and ultra quiet cabin. You do get bigger tires and rims , though. Now, to compare it to a std. equipped Fit Sport you need to add a spoiler $385, foglights $350, leather steering wheel $279, security system $499, 15" alloy rims $665, and lowering springs since the Sport has a lower/firmer suspension than the Base $199, for a total of $2377 in xA add-ons for a total MSRP of $17,147(2,377options+650 airbags+14,120 AT MSRP) compared to an AT Sport's $15, 970, and you still don't get the 5th gear and paddle shifters, aero kit, cruise, and 200w 6-speaker stereo that plays MP3's AND WMA files and has an aux audio input in the console (iPod, etc.). Take into consideration that my OTD price was $882 less than the $17,147 MSRP for the similarly equipped xA, and I got a bargain. If I had gotten the AT instead, I'd still be ~$82 lower OTD than the xA's MSRP. Scion doesn't haggle, so both vehicles would sell at MSRP. Do the math and compare the features and you'll find both vehicles are extremely comparable. Like I said, I would never have traded in my xB unless I knew for certain I was getting a better vehicle for the money.

BTW -- I loved my xB and Scion, and I'll always be a fan, so in no way am I saying the Fit is a better car than the xA in any way shape or form other than based on features vs. price per your original point. I'm sure Scion will turn the tables at some point in the future. Sorry for the looooong post.

 

Actually, the fit sport is the only one that can be reasonably compared the the xA. With the exception of the paddle shifters. By somewhat more powerful engine, you mean 6 extra horsepower, which is basically nothing and means it probably turns one more HP at the wheels.
Aero kit is kinda irrelevant, since the scion already has the agressive look the aero kit was trying to create.
xA has a smaller turning radius, not the fit. xA is 34.3 ft, fit is 35.6.

The sound system in the xA can only be compared to the fit sport's, as wattage doesn't matter but the # of speakers does. The 200W system is the only one with 6 speakers, which would be the match the the xA, since the xA has six speakers, MP3/WMA capability, and the aux in.
The sport isn't really a "premium grade." It just comes standard with things you'd pay for on the base fit, but that doesn't mean you necessarily get them cheaper.

All the features you said make the fit sport better are mostly cosmetic- fog lights, steering wheel, spoiler. They don't improve the performance or comfort of the car, so I don't really consider them useful features. I would consider it a premium grade if it came with a performance engine. As it is what makes it sporty is its appearance, for the most part, an area in which I think the xA has it beat.


I don't mean to make it sound like this is an xA versus fit post, but I really don't think getting rims and a spoiler really makes the fit the "better car." All the things you said about performance (tighter handling etc) are preference and the turning radius info wasn't correct. I think people should buy what fits their needs but to me, the fit wasn't an appropriate car. Plus I sat in one and those funky seats were hell on my back. No support at all. Since i wasn't comfortable in it, it wasn't the car for me, no matter how nice it was. Plus I didn't really want a honda.

also, tiny point, but those color keyed headlights look funny.

So anyway, point being, even if you compare base fit to base xA, they have different feature sets and different appeal. I thought the fit looked like a mini minivan, which wasn't what I was going for. I wanted something "younger."

We'll see how they do over the next few years.

 

The guy is a total a$$. It is not his place to do a stranger's car shopping. Educated people make educated decisions AFTER doing their OWN research.
If she didn't know what she was buying and what the competition was, she might as well buy a 1980's Geo Metro.
That being said, Honda makes great cars- but Toyotas are far superior!

 

yeah that guy was a complete d!ck. but she obviously did not shop around. but what does he know. maybe she needed a car right then and was just in love with the xA.

I am a former honda person and went with toyota ONLY because i have had the same problem with my civic for over 3 years and it cannot be fixed. i figured that there was something better out there and toyota has always carried a good rep.

if it wasn't for the fit being released this year, then i probably would have bought it last year when i picked up my xA instead. i just can't seem to bring myself to pay $20K + for a civic. they lost a lot of customers there with the price increase.

just my 2 cents.

 

the crazy part was that he knew the papers were already signed and still told the girl it wasn't too late to back out. That's a douche move. She already bought it...this is what pushes today's insane society of bending every rule/law possible.

By the way, I loved my Mini as much as the xA, but now I have different needs. Same deal when I got rid of our Protege5 for the Mini...you could say it about any car. The fact is, people buy what is best for them at the time.

Oh, and we used to see this kind of stuff happen at the BMW lot I used to work at...we probably would have just paid the lot boy $20 to take the valve cores out of the kid's tires and set them on the roof. "Sorry, kid...our shop doesn't have a compressor. Maybe the Honda dealer down the street does."

 

actually she might have shopped around for what she wanted and at the time she was doing her research, the Fit might not have been listed. i first started looking at the xA a year ago.

Even if she did find it in her searches, she may have already been working with this dealer for several weeks to get that xA, in which case there would have been no or very few fits available to see or test drive. I know where I live fits are just getting to lots now and most dealers only have one or two.

 

Also, FWIW, I like the Fit. And for MUCH more money, I like the Mazda5. But I'll be driving the xA for a few more years.

 

"Just thought I'd point out that they're not a good comparison price wise...one is almost $2500 more."-- First their not comparable, and now it's the only one that compares . . . .

On a ~100hp motor, 6hp is 6hp, and would be about the gain you'd see if you added I/H/E to the 1NZ-FE. Wheel HP is a moot point since I've yet to see any dyno charts for a stock NA Fit to compare. If you only sat in the Fit and never drove it you can't say much, because I'll tell you from experience there is a noticeble difference between the engines in feel and response, with the Honda pulling harder in the mid-high range and being the freer revving, more responsive one of the two.

I've heard both cars described as 'rolling doorstops' on a number of other forums, so we're even here.

You have your figures reversed and are quoting the xA inaccurately, too. Scion's specs on the xA website list it as 36.1 ft, Fit is 34.3 on Honda's.

Ok, but even at 6 speakers, we're still up by 40w, which is noticeable -- and you don't have the speed variable volume either, which sounds like a stupid feature, but really comes in handy when you're on-off the highway a lot and get sick of fiddling w/ the volume all the time.

Honda refers to the Sport as the premium grade of Fit in their press releases as do numerous reviews. Sport has all the bells and whistles of the two, hence it's the premium/deluxe grade of the two. You can't pay to get the Sport features on the Base as there are no options to speak of for either car. (from the factory; dealers will install anything if you pay them)

Better in the sense of value -- to get a similarly equipped xA you have to spend $1177 more then the MSRP of the Fit Sport, thus the Sport is a better value feature for feature. Whether the features are of value to the purchaser or not is their call, and in your case they're not. That's cool, you got what you wanted. Aesthetics, though, are not what make the Sport sporty, 12.8:1, 2.41 lock-to-lock steering (EVO 9 MR's is 13:1, to compare), a low mounted central fuel tank, a low ride height, an universally noted rigid cage-style frame, a butter-smooth shifter and matching clutch, an equally smooth and responsive engine, pedals you can actually heel-toe with, and a controllable, well dampened and tuned suspension, do. To quote Car and Driver, ". . .the Fit sailed through our lane-change test 6 mph faster than anything else here — faster, in fact, than a Corvette Z06. Abetting the handling was linear, direct steering — you could pick out a pebble at an apex and reliably place the Fit’s inside-front wheel directly atop it." http://www.caranddriver.com/comparis...fit-sport.html

As stated, I was correct. re: performance see above again.

If you don't like it, then you don't like it. Can't argue with that, I'd do the same myself.

heh, I've got a set of the black ones near the top of my list of future mods.

Good idea, so let's call it quits here, shake hands, and watch the upcoming battle instead of wasting more of the forum's space. Cheers!

 

I've owned 6 honda's and the xA is my first toyota. i still love honda's but in my opinion they have lost touch with their customer base. the Civic used to be a great car but now that it's not a cheap car it has lost it's identity. The Fit simply cannot compare to the Civic's of the early 90's. Those old hatches and coupes were great cars for what they cost. I'm not saying Honda's cars now aren't great but they are too expensive and a Fit isn't really a tuner car in my opinion. A 2006 Civic DX is $14,500 without stereo or air conditioning. Honda simply does not make a car that compares to those old Civics. I think the xA fills that void best.

 

actually, chikubi, the scion stereos DO have speed variable sound, and it's a really annoying feature. That's all I'm gonna respond to since most of what you said isn't relevant ("butter smooth shifter" is a personal opinion only, I drove the fit and found that the automatic, left to its own devices, was neverable to efficiently find the right gear and going uphill the thing shifted every ten or so feet...not what I'd consider good.) And you can heel toe in the xA, i do it all the time, and sometimes by accident.

I would never buy a car with a central fuel tank. Why? because I don't feel it's safe with the prevalence of side impacts to the drivers side to be sitting atop a loaded tank of fuel. That's a time bomb waiting to go off and at least with fuel tanks more towards the rear or center of the body, the tank has a chance of not getting compressed, ruptured, or set on fire.

All those airbags you get with the fit don't help much when you're on fire. The airbags are yet another reason I don't like/can't buy the fit. At 5' tall, it's dangerous for me to be in a car with that many airbags. It's far more likely I will get my neck snapped with all those airbags mounted high, At least scion gave people like me the choice to not have a feature that's not safe for them, in what is supposed to be the "safer car."

Anyway, shake hands I'm done, we're not going to agree. I'm gonna leave this one where it stands now and go get me some breakfast.

 

that car isnt that much bigger.

 

honda=dime a dozen

scion are rarer too see then a honda

 

Personally I think the base Fit is fugly. The sport looks more or less ok but is $3k more than an xA and in my opinion, still fuglier. If the sprt was about 14k, then I'd look into it more but at 16k I'd MUCH rather drop another grand to get a tC with about 50 more hp ....

BTW, what's heel toe? (damn i feel like such a noob)