xb_slowon

I would be nice but no contest its not even funny how bad you'd get beat, I mean just left for dead flat-out. The cooper S makes 160h.p only the WORKS package gives it 200 h.p. and it is over $5000.00 thats 1/3 of what the xb costs!!!. and it weighs i belive 2800 lbs. It has the 6-sp Getrag. I have 180h.p. in my Matrix XRS but not alot of tourqe. The toyota 6-speed sucks. My freinds cooper S beats the Matrix all the way up to about 120 mph where i can pull it but not by much, only due to the extreme intake capabilities of the high speed cam @ 8500rpm, intake,exhaust. The cooper S is one bad-___ little car especilly with the works package, but then your looking at 15k scion out the door vs. 20-25k for the cooper that is if you can find a cooper for sale at sticker price.
But the Scion is FAR AND AWAY MORE RELIABLE, my freinds has seen the dealer about 6 times the build quality sucks in comparison. Im so glad I bought my XB instead of the mini S. come next year im keping the XB. The matrix gets traded in on the new Mustang w 300 hp/300lb N/A and a bulletproof drivetrain. Im keeping the XB till it dies then im going to rebuild it again and again.

mainuhtz

isnt a stock cooper juss 110hp while the xb is 105hp. I was juss wonderin since the s is juss a supercharged version at 200hp, if the soon to come super/turbo chargers would gain the same amount or even more hp into the xb witt cheaper or equal results on cash.

ncscion

http://www.miniusa.com/link/ourcars/...specifications

it says 169hp which is less than that at the wheels. our s/c are making 130 something hp. i would think they will be able to do better than this with the t/c by a little. the xb's c/r is too high to boost too much and have it be reliable.

jackmott

the regular mini is 115hp, and at its weight has slightly less horsepower per pound than a scion XA (dunno about XB, it would be close)

the mini cooper S is supercharged and has liek 160hp, way more hp per pound than the XA or XB

better rear suspension design and lower center of gravity too. in performance terms its better in almost every way except absolute weight.

TheScionicMan

Here's a comparison of the two from Edmunds.com. The xB stacks up pretty well:

http://scion.edmunds.com/products/nvc/scion/VehicleComparison;jsessionid=AL2Tm1w2zlS611tCazXQoVzikwqQ2PUWUwDoJEgKrDQv54TLW2VS!486482776!174352299!7001!7002?basestyleid=100257487&styleid=100330896&refid=&maxvehicles=5&op=3&tab=measurements

TheScionicMan

Ooops, didn't see it was regarding the S, I compared it to the base model...

Sorry about the looooooong link too.

TeamMightyMiniz

Sorry guys, the standard cooper would kill either scion (point would be more accurate if both vehicles were driven by one driver)... don't even bother with the S or JCW

Look at your rear "old school" axles... it's a no go and I wouldn't suggest you try. But if you think you can...
Come up to Willow Springs on Sunday March 28th for some time trials held by http://touringcarclub.com/

If you decide to come out, use the registration code TEAMMIGHTYMINIZ for a discount.

We will be running a Super Tuner MCS against a Subaru STi and we will be WINNING.

More info Here

Subcompact Culture

I know jackmott has done an open-track day with his xA …

Although I understand that an independant rear suspension is superior handling wise, there have been quite a few rear beam-axle cars that clean up on autocross and road racing tracks. 1992-1994 Nissan Sentra SE-R anyone? The Maxima also uitilizes (utilized?) a rear beam. It's not impossible to make a car with such a suspension handle well.

mainuhtz

im juss a kid a was juss learnin my hw about how good the box could be. I was hopin if this car could underdog big contenders, but so far no hope. I f i waited for another year would theree be enough upgrades to surpass any other car.

jackmott

any other car?

with enough ingenuity you could do that NOW. But we are talking real scion project type stuff. Like building your own double wishbone suspension, putting a v8 inside the hatch =)

look at my autocross results I posted in the corner carvers section.

you don't need to spend money to beat better cars, just get good at driving and get some good tires.

this doesn't apply to drag racing so much, short of an engine swap the scions aren't going to be too good at that, and driver skill will not buy you much drag racing relativel slow cars.

mainuhtz

nothing radical like engine swaps n tearin the box appart.

I meant like since its a jap import, its exposed to being a scene wear its full of aftermarket parts everywhere.

So far Im hearin that the s/c or t/c cant give any more power since compression on the box is already high as it is. Plus its a _____ to install any charger since its placed behind the engine. This is stuff ive been hearin off these forums so i dont know if any of is true.

How good would a drop n pullin off a chop top xb lower its center of gravity.

I know the xbs engine was never meant to pull off power, but has anyone even passed 130 hp for the love god.

I was really interested in this car but now im thinkin id juss rather pick sum old driftin 80's car for cheap n its more satisfying.

someone here, prove me this car is good, dont give me this reliabilty crap or its cruisin capability, its saves gas, etc.....

is it a crap car or not?

Djuan

well, considering that the mini (base) is a few thousand more, with the extra cash, I would think it would be possible to beat it...

and then what do you guys think, a supercharged xA vs. a mini S ??? probably advantage mini S...

striker79

All this talk about high compression come on people what do you think bmw did with the coopers to get the compression down for the s my guess would be thicker head gasket.It would lower compression probable the same thing you would have to do with the scion.Then it's box wins

scionxb04

deck plate....very easily get 9to1 or 8to1 compression....then boost

TeamMightyMiniz

Ain't happening.

You'd need more than what you're imagining.

think Outside of the box.

Read some mini Stats...

Ranking in #1 in MANY MANY MANY lists, Beating Porsches in slalom, on the track, in the canyons.

throw an LSD in a MINI or MINI S and BAM .
Come out and hang with us one day and find out...
Or come to our time trail event in ButtonWillow on the 28th.

We'll have several coopers and other cars out there... Walk the walk. Come see what you're contemplating.

I love the Scion's, but scion vs mini....

then of course you'd need equally matched drivers... or someone with a fat ego!

mainuhtz

Is it true the box handles like a porche?

Djuan

I agree the mini is cool, but I have a hard time believing that if you spent that much on a mini, then if you bought an xA and spent the excess on some serious mods, that you couldn't match them...

TeamMightyMiniz

$13k for an xA
$18k for a Mini

$5k in mods on an xA stilll will not allow for a win... especially in a canyon...

But if you're up for the challenge... say the word... we're ready!

We also have a Turbo Cooper


Remeber, your xA rear end won't be able to handle the corners as well as the rear of a mini.

It's a pointless arguement.

striker79

What kinda numbers is the turbo cooper puting out.Also working for bmw i know the coopers handle like there on rails but also know they are not with out there flaws also so considering that the scions are new and after market manufactures are planing or putting together super chargers and turbo set ups where do you think this discussion will be like in say five years.I doubt the xb or xa could take a copper or s in the twistys but what about other areas.

jackmott

eh, on a number of road courses you could beat the mini just by putting out a bunch more power, which 5k could do.

you could also just show up on far stickier and larger rubber and win.

but I would agree, that matched closely in terms of tire and power, it would be quite a science project to get the Scion to match the mini.

if any of your mini team is in texas, id be happy to meet them at Texas World Speedway or a Houston Autocross.