xa007xa

i'm about to throw down for pistons and rods before i get a turbo. since i'll already be having the shop take apart the engine, what else should i upgrade internally along with the rods and pistons?

drbelanger

I'm just begining to look into modifications on the xB engine. Really my experiance comes from working on my Integra but i would imagine the same rules apply.

What are you trying to accomplish as far as replacing the pistons? Are you looking to up the compression? I gather you are looking to go all motor?

chicotunner07

low compression pistons if ur going booster route

drbelanger

Hmm didnt mean to post that yet i had more to say...

Changing the compression of an engine requires other modifications depending on how extreme you want to go. Go to high and you end up needing race gas to get down the road. Engines are built for specific purposes, a racing engine will perform like a wet sock on the street, and a street engine just cannot hang at the extremes that a race engine does.

I am a hobby mechanic and i dont know how well versed in such things you are. I make no great claims of knowledge on my own part and you may indeed know more than me.

Gone are the days of twisting on a carburator. ECU's will largely determine what kind of fuel mixture you are going to run. Manufacturers largely expect you will run the car on low octane gas so it tends to be on the rich side. My 05 xB actually runs better on 87 octane.

Tuning is not some magic word either. Adjustable cam gears, fuel pumps and programable ECUs will all facilitate tuning. All you are really doing is finding the optimum ratios that facilitate performance on that specific engine or engine build. Dont be sucked in by the aftermarket game.

Decide on a very specific goal for your engine and then stick to it. A high compression naturally aspriated engine is not going to respond to a turbo being slapped on it. Running anything over 15psi boost is going to require different components on the engine. Cylinder walls tend to be a weakness in Honda engines, i dont know about toyota. A carefully laid out plan is going to do you well in the end. Experimenting will get you a garage full of spare parts and a big hole in your bank account.

greybox

It all depends on what's available.

Get the head ported/polished and flowed-especially with a turbo the higher airflow will make a big difference in power and functionality. Three way valve job will help too.

Balanced crank shaft, knife edged possibly, helps it spin easier, faster and with less bad vibration.

Lightened pulley-Perrin, power agency-makes it easier for the motor to spin.

Lighetened flywheel helps it spin but you will loose some inertia in the motor too that makes it easier to not stall while driving away from a stop.

Keep it cool! Intecooler is a big thing-maybe some sort of oil cooling system as well.

There was a thread somewhere (sorry deleted my history from yesterday) but I will try to find it-fully built xB putting out over 200-lot of prototype engine parts

greybox

Here's that link-BIG numbers! (Oh yeah, the photos are tC but the dyno numbers are xB-look at the header on the graphs)

http://itsmyscion.com/ScionCREW/phot...060bc7a7777e/1

killerxromances

i ran high compression on my turbo box when i had it.

contact me if you want a complete list of parts, companies, and phone numbers to check out to have parts made.

greybox

203hp! WOW!

First-how did you maintain any traction? Second-what kind of cost did you have to get those numbers? Was it reliable and streetable?

killerxromances

Traction - Hardly, spun all down the track unless i ran slicks, autocross wasn't too bad unless i got excited!

Cost - $12,XXX in the motor, including tuning standalone.

Reliable - I had problems all throughout the build, at 14Xwhp cracked two motor mounts and blew a rod. At 180whp blew my 2nd rod, had to replace the pistons and another motor mount. Once i broke 200+whp i had issues with over-heating. Engine gave out twice along the way as well and had to stop to re-build.

Streetable - I drove it almost every day, but i wouldn't recommend it. More headaches but when it ran, it was incredible.

MPG - dont ask.

greybox

So given that you obviously spent the money and time to find the outer limits-where does the car stay reliable yet balance with the huge amount of fun?

How would you go about doing this on a budget as well?

Summary (I guess), throw the cai, header, exhaust and pulley at it and then what? (Turbo, NOS?-what is worth it?)

killerxromances

Well unfortunately theres no such thing as "cheap power". But if you are looking for the most fun while keeping the best reliability id say..


after the intake and header id say..

All Motor:
2.25'' full exhaust (not just axle)
11:1 pistons
port and polish head
itb's (individual throttle bodies)
AEM Standalone ecu
Upgrade Clutch
Replace motor mounts

That would net you in the ball park of 140whp if you have a damn good tune. Cost can range anywhere from $5,000+ depending on several factors. But i personally would go n/a simply because i had the most fun driving the box while it was naturally aspirated, plus the sound of itb's is incredible!

killerxromances

Oh and to answer the question of what was worth it..

Well it depends. But keep in mind your not going to have "reliable power gains" cheaply, your not going to gain power period on low budget.

Another thing to consider is all f/i and naturally aspirated mods such as high compression pistons or itb's will require premium gas. You also want to run synthetic motor oil as well as transmission fluids.

So, while the cost of your build may be x,xxx, there are other costs to consider as well.

It's worth it if you can afford it.

JSosa

What motor mounts did you use and where did you get them??

I hit 171 WHP on my xA, of course ive had problems, but ive never had to open my block (thank god). Ive never spun a bearing or a blew a rod. Im running 7.5lbs.

There is no way to make cheap power with a 1.5L there just isn't enough displacement where you bolt on a few intake and exhuats mods and you went up 20 WHP, it just DOESN'T exist. You want power, your going to have to pay for it.

Like killerxromances said, it worth it if you have the money. If you dont then just dont bother then headaches involved with such a build are HUGE!!

Right now im facing a leaky header problem due to all the 3 bolts lost the thread on the head, so im looking into rethreading these holed, but for that i have to take out the head or try perma-coils (which i already purchased), to see what happens.

The cheapest way to get power is a good forced induction kit, a well tuned ECU, and enough gas to supply the pistons. This will still run you about $4,500...

MilfHunter

Yeah they need to take pictures!

Guest

where are you getting your parts if you don't mind me asking?

xa007xa

crower makes the rods. check out importperformanceparts.net for the engine kit. it comes with wiseco pistons. i got a kit that someone put together off of ebay that includes the rods and pistons among other stuff. however the pistons are 10:1 and .030 over so I'm selling them because I want to 8.5:1 for the turbo.

Winter

please stay away from ebay systems =[
ya, cheap power gains but you'll cause your self LOTS of problems...

this is a habit of a freind of mine who i've been trying to tell him to stay away from ebay parts. every car he's used these parts on end up going down the drain and fast.

the kit at importperformanceparts.net is your best option pretty much. i think crower will do cam regrinds if i remember correctly and then there is also a yamaha bike you can take the valve train of off and use that to increase the rpm range and power abilites a bit. i can't remember exactly on both of these facts but there are people on this board who can back me up on this, one of them being one of the main people who use and modify those valve train components to fit the 1NZFE. i think when i asked i was qouted about $1,300... or $900... i can't remember. the regrinds are about $100 per cam rod if i remember correctly.

though if you were willing to threw this, you would need a good standalone settup like the F-con from HKS or something. you just need to have a deep pocket and it'll work just fine.

itsme

killerxromances knows his stuff and pretty much the in's and outs of this motor so im pretty sure he can help you out cuzz i know i'll b asking him for advice in the not to distant future......as far as over heating Tony wasnt it because u were running high compression and boost?

i would luv to go all motor but all motor is expensive so ill will have to go FI until i can afford the all motor setup cuzz i would luv some ITBs

killerxromances

It had to do with the water pump, air pockets when i replaced some of the lines, one time unknown. lol