Notacop

I am planning on doing some minor suspension mods.

I come from a BIG family, both in number and in size, Average weight is 250+ so if I have a car full of 4 that is 1k lbs of weight (more likely 1200+) . Take into account that I have a stereo that is also another 300-500 all said and done and my dual borla tips scrape the ground going up driveways and on some bigger dips in the road if I have it loaded down.


My driving is about 50% just me in the car, 35% me and 1 passenger, 10% me and 2 passengers, and the last 5% (if that) is me and 3 passengers.


I am currently planning on airlift bags inside the rear springs. They are Part number 60774, and should help keep the rear from bottoming out with extra weight, they will also bring the rear back to stock ride height, and allow the Monroe 5987 rear shocks I am planning on adding to sit in their proper operating range.


The monroe's should help improve the ride over stock, but that may be negated by the stiffer spring rate with the airbags helping out.


I drive 30 miles of rural 2 lane to and from work every day, potholes are pretty common out here, especially in the towns on less than main roads. The smoother the car will ride the better. Would some other springs help smooth the ride? I do enjoy taking corners "spirited" from time to time, and would not really want to lose any handling, and gaining handling would be a plus.

Lowering is not out of the question, but it would have to be a slight drop. In all the research I have done on the forums here, there are a few options:

Tein H-Techs
Hotchkis springs (would get the stage 1 kit with springs and swaybars)
Progress Tech (again would go kit with rear sway bar)

Would any of these be an improvement in ride over the stock springs? If not an improvement then at least not a noticable loss of ride quality?


I have heard a few horror stories about reliablity and consistency of the hotchkis setup, and the progress tech might be lower than I want to go (potholes and possibility of deep unplowed snow scare me off).

I have also seen mention of throwing stock xA springs on the xB, lower spring rate, same height for a much smoother ride.


Any suggestions you guys can give?

jomo

With that amount of weight, you will need a pretty healthy spring. Especially if lowered. This would eliminate the Progress or H-tech. If you are o.k. with stock height, I would leave the stock springs. They are what you need. Lot's of travel, pretty stiff, and you can buy shocks that work comfortably with them. Just add a rear sway and some beefier tires and you should have the handling improvement you are looking for.

Notacop

For reference, here is my family....

http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y20...cop/family.jpg


I am the one in the middle back row, between my wife and my brother in the tie die.


With myself and the stereo, I am running700+lbs in the car at a minimum, and the bulk of the stereo is directly over the rear tires. See here for system: https://www.scionlife.com/forums/viewtopic.php?t=141300


Some people talk about other springs riding better than stock. I took that to mean smoother and more comfortable, but I am not sure if that is what they actually meant. The weight over the rear will be handled by the airbags, so that should not be a major issue.

The more I think of it, the more I think the progress tech would be too low.


I think if I lowered it I would go h-tech. But I am pretty sure I will try the airbags and monroes on the back first. Then when I can afford it throw on the progress tech rear bar. By then new tires will be required, hoping to be able to afford rims by then (17-18"), then after that see if h-techs are something I want to get.

Gsnorgathon

Do be careful upsizing those rims - the shorter the tire, the harsher the ride, and the more likely you are to bend your bigger rims with all that weight you're carrying through those potholes.

Notacop

That is why I am leaning towards 17's, that plus cheaper rims and cheaper tires!

bB2NER

I'd leave the stock springs and add the Monroe rear shocks and either TRD,Progress or Whiteline rear swaybar. This is my set-up and it rides 100% better than stock and still handles like on rails.

tanakasan

^^x2 on the stock springs, Monroes and rear sway.

Also, stock size tires and 15" rims are your friend for a cush ride and pothole insurance. I just went with 17x7 and 215/45s. Slightly harsher (@40psi) than stock and more responsive. And this is all city street type stuff, no country roads. Not sure if larger rims/thinner tires would fit your needs.

BTW, Garrett, looks like you're the runt of the litter! J/K! Good luck on your quest for better handling!

Notacop

Oh yeah, I am the oldest of my brothers and the shortest @ 6'2"!!!


If you take that into account you really get a idea of the scale of things. My Wife is 5'10"

tanakasan

You all remind me of my brother in law's side of the family.

He is 6-2 and big like you! Thats coming from me...5-6 and all of a "buck and a half" soaking wet!

06B0X

I actually know where your coming from and did a TON of research on the subject before I made my purchases. I've purchased Monroe shocks and Tein H-techs. Shocks will be here Thursday and the springs are coming directly from Tein with no ETA.

If there are any other questions you might have, shoot them at me. I've asked many people there input and think I've purchased a good combination.

If you want a softer spring without lowering you could spend $400 on Ground Control coilovers w/ custom Eibach springs. I went with $180 Tein H-techs instead.

Notacop

You will have to keep me posted on your thoughts with the H-techs. Are you going to run the monroes with stock suspension while you wait for the h-techs or are you going to do it all at once?

06B0X

As of right now, all at once since I see no point taking it all out twice. I don't need the practice.

The company I purchased the H-techs is waiting for there arrival from Tein to them and then to me. Lucky I only live 2 hours away from them so I should only lose a day in the turn around time.

Notacop

There is no real taking it out twice though.

The only thing you are duplicating by not doing them both at the same time is that you will need to unbolt the lower rear shock mount again to pull the springs out. Other than that, they are 2 entirely seperate jobs.


If you decide to do it all at once, that is cool too, but I would be very interested in hearing the results of each one seperately.


We all know the monroes make it ride better, but with monroes already in stalled will you notice an improvement in ride going from stock springs to the h-tech's.... hmmmm

06B0X

Good point, I may just do that. The monroes will be here Thursday, I might install them Saturday - hell I gotta start loosening all the interior bolts up for the sound deadening install next weekend.

bB2NER

Doing just the Monroes will make ALL the difference. The springs will do nothing for smoothing out the ride. They will only lower it and limit the areas you can safely drive without dragging.

Notacop

you don't think different spring rates, or even progressive spring rates would have a noticable impact on the smoothness of the ride??? I respectfully disagree.


I do think that the monroes will make a more noticable difference, but I highly doubt it would be ALL the difference.

If we were just talking about cutting the springs lower, or using shorter springs with the same spring rate, then I would agree 100%

bB2NER

That's fine. They didn't do any change in ride quality when I went from stock to the Hotchkisses. Springs support the weight of the vehicle. The harshness in the stock ride is purly the fault of the stock shocks. Try the Monroes first and see what I'm talking about.

06B0X

Jethro I've also got to disagree due to the spring rate post listed at the top of this forum:

Company Item Front Rear Front Rear Color MSRP Applic.

Stock
Scion xB - - 148 160
Tein H-Tech 1.1" 0.9" 129 179
Toyota bB/ist - - 125 134

While the rear spring is slightly stiffer, that will allow the Monroe’s to do what they need to do, absorb. However the front spring will make a difference as it’s softer. As I posted, I did a TON of research about this and this is the best bang for the buck that I can see. Maybe I'm wrong but heck, I'll know once it’s all installed.

I decided against the front shocks since they will automatically drop the front a half inch and I didn't want to get into Tanabe/Koni springs just yet. Like I've been saying, I don't want to drop it but it’s the most money conscience thing I can do. I've even had the chance to buy OEM 1.5 litre bB springs but that’s just overkill for what I'm looking to accomplish.

While I doubt I'll install just the shocks, I'll have to see what Saturday brings me.

bB2NER

I hope they do what you want them to. The Hotchkis ones didn't for me. I just wish I had known about the Monroe shocks first and saved the money spent on the springs for something better.

jomo

More than likely, the harshness Notacop is feeling in the ride is the shocks. If your car is loaded with weight, you need stiffer springs to support the weight as a weighted down car will more likely bottom. The stock springs meet this "stiffer" category and they are what you need with a heavy family onboard. They also provide more travel as when you add weight, the car will lower "naturally" which reduces suspension travel.

If you load your car with weight, install soft lowering springs (H-techs) and on top of that use lower compression damping shocks (Monroes), you will ride very smoothly until you hit your first big bump. You can easily bottom the front shock. Perhaps very smooth, but bottoming is a serious shortcoming.

Another bonus of using the stock springs is that a Monroe shock will work correctly for comfort.

If more handling is desired, a stiff rear sway can be added. This will have a minimum impact to the ride with maximum performance benefit. Better tires will also help here. Good luck.