Wow.

No, there will not be one.

Just ask the Prius drivers, their numbers are much further off. The problem is with the EPA's testing. They give out the ratings, not the manufacturer. Most cars are off, but it's a percentage. Thus, as the estimated mileage gets higher, so will the drop in mileage.

Example: My 100 mpg car has only been gettin 90, and my 10 mpg truck has been getting 9. Both are off by 10%, but I am going to notice the 10 lost miles per gallon on the car more.

Personally, I drive somewhere between sissy and aggressive, right in the middle, and I usually get 29. Last fillup was 27. I was very happy since that was all city and all A/C, and I am still getting twice what I was in my last car.

 

I'm beginning to think the reason for the poor gas milage is the sweet aerodynamics of the xB...

I'm sure when they did the test for milage it was on some kind of dyno which was able to maintain a constant load over a period of time.

It's much different when you are driving down the road in a box. Don't underestimate the affect of aerodynamics on how hard the engine has to work to maintain speed.

My xB gets 24-28 miles per gallon, even when I baby it. I don't complain though, that's about what I expected with the boxy shape.

 

Just thought I would add my experience. I have gotten a very reliable 27-31 MPG on my 05 XB. This is using the crummy California gas and driving around 75mph. I actually got 30 mpg on a trip to the mountians...maybe the cold air helped. I do not have any engine mods as of yet and have stock tires. I am looking to add cold air induction and possibly some larger wheels...I can let you know what it looks like at that point if it helps any. But I am happy with 30mpg when I am driving a brick in to the wind.

-Fez

 

I've seen the testing specs for the EPA's test and the car is on a dyno, and run to specific speeds at certain time intervals. Aerodynamics does not play a part in the test. They may put the Cd in a formula to spit out the final numbers, but the testing is done on a dyno.

Additionally, they do not even measure the amount of fuel used. The test measures some specific chemical produced in the combustion process in order to know how much fuel was used.

 

I don't believe my expectations are false. In reading the responses, I did a quick search and confirmed the ratings ARE provided by the manufacturs. The EPA only requires the ratings be provided to the consumer. See their website:
http://www.fueleconomy.gov/feg/ratin...cription.shtml

Note that it requires that most drivers will acheive mileage ratings in the range given.

I also found with interest a bill in congress from AAA:
http://www.theorator.com/bills109/hr1103.html

It points out why the test's values are bunk, and why everyone gets mileage that is WORSE than the EPA tests. It sound like the test is a tool to help corporations skirt the fuel mileage requirements set by the feds. Their average highway speed for the test is 48mph. If the test was realistic, then your choice of driving style should allow you to achieve the estimate on a regular basis.

I have to point out that poster's satisfaction in their mileage when compared to their previous cars is not a valid argument. My satisfaction should be based on whether the car meets the manufacturer's statement of expected mileage. Many people use those numbers to help in their decision on which auto to purchase.

 

Yes, the MPG ratings are US Government figures, the testing is required to be done in a specific way by US Government regs, and those same figures are required to be on the vhicle sticker by the US Government.

The testing does not take into consideration aerodynamics 'cause it is done on a dyno, and the programed test is set to determine the BEST mileage the vehicle CAN get if driven cautiously by someone's grandmother on level ground to church on Sunday...in a computer.

If one drives ANY differently than that, all bets are off.

Toyota (and other manufacturers) have nothing to do with the numbers or the tests - other than having their engineers tweek many of their designs to get good numbers on the government test, of course.

(That's what happened with the Prius - its programming is tweeked to exactly complement the government tests, and to give incredible figures in that one artificial environment. The cars really do perform well in real life, but not as well as they do on a dyno with KNOWN program requirements...)

There is currently action afoot (partly lead by one of my senators) to revamp the government test to more reflect the Real World[tm] and to offer up different ratings for 'conservative' and 'spirited' driving styles - these tests would also have to consider aerodynamics and other effects.

So, don't blame the manufacturers, blame the US Government for the rigged testing with all the variables known. OF COURSE the cars are going to lean a bit toward scoring well in the tests...

 

OK, my fault for saying that the EPA ran the tests, but regardless of who runs the test, it is the same test being run from car to car, as required, and it is not Toyota's fault for being off. Most people know the test provides false results on every vehicle, if not, they should do more research. Several years ago (was it 1981?) the EPA changed a multiplier in a formula somewhere, and the results were spot on after that. If they would do the same again, we'd all be happy campers.

I'd say that my average of 29 mpg with 90% city driving is very close to the advertised 30.

 

Here's the experience so far for me...I've had my xB for 2 weeks. The first week, back and forth to work..18 miles each way, freeway and city...30mpg. Last week I drove up to Chicago and cruising up I65 at 70-75mph, I got just over 31mpg. I don't know if I'm just luck, or it's the way I drive. I don't really push it to get up to speed, if it takes me a mile to get up to 70, that's okay..also, no jack rabbit starts.

 

Heh. I drive mostly city/suburban in very hilly country (heck, my driveway is a second gear 1/3 mile...).

My average is around 28MPG in an automatic with some rather spirited driving. If I back off and drive very conservatively I can actually hit the EPA numbers.

Thing is, I DON'T drive like that...

 

I got 28 mpg one time. The rest of the time it is 25 or 26. My wife does about 27. I have never made 30.

 

All I know is that I get 240 miles per tank. It does not matter how I drive. I mostly drive calm and not jack rabbit my starts. 240 per tank with the light on stinks. I would be greatful and happy with 300 per tank.

 

With 240 miles on it before the light comes on, you could probably reach 300 before it's last gasp: The light comes on at 2-2.5 gallons still in the tank. Thing is, I don't like to run mine down that low unless I absolutely have to - I like more stress-free driving. :D

 

I am sorry, I should clarify. My light does not come on at 240. I drive for awhile with the light on. The light comes on at 220.

 

What I said was that the manufacturers are required to use EPA-mandated methodology. The tests are conducted by the manufacturers, but they have no leeway in how to do them, and they have to provide the numbers that result.

As for expectations, read what it actually says on the sticker that was on your car, the one you say should give you a basis for your expectations:

"Actual mileage will vary with options, driving conditions, driving habits and vehicle's condition. Results reported to EPA indicate that the majority of vehicles with these estimates [31/35 in the case of my 05 auto] will achieve between

26 and 30 mpg in the city and between
29 and 51 on the highway."

So right there on the label, it says that you should expect as little as 29 mpg in a car with original equipment, depending on how you drive and how your car is equipped. I'm sure a roof rack full of stuff wasn't part of the test.

I have no problem with real-world testing. I think you should support that bill, if you feel so strongly about it. I don't even argue that the current methodology is at least in part a product of the manufacturers' influence, 35 years ago when this testing was mandated, in pushing for test methods they could live with.

And if the manufacturers claimed that you would actually achieve those numbers, without plenty of disclaimers and warnings that any alert consumer knows better than to ignore, you might even have a case. But they do provide those disclaimers and warnings, and guess what? They turn out to mean something.

Oh, and Consumer Reports does real-world testing of fuel economy. Of course, they do silly things like obeying the speed limit, starting and stopping gently, and testing the car as it came from the factory. But here were their results on an '04 5-speed:

CU's overall mileage, mpg 32
CU's city/highway, mpg 25/36
CU's 150-mile trip, mpg 37

If you read the manufacturer's entire statement, and base your expectations on that, it's possible to be entirely satisfied.

RichC

 

Here in Ga, its hotter than a mother, so I run the A/c every time I get in my Xb, but I still get 27-29 MPG. I have 2 12" subs adding weight too, but I just replaced my stock rims w/ lightweight 15" rims that only wiegh about 10lbs apiece whi Im hoping might bump m up to 30 mpg.

 

Turn off the A/C unless you really need it. Dump all excess weight. Every pound makes a difference. Keep your tires inflated to the high side. Keep yur foot out of the throttle body. Take it slow. Stay out of traffic jams, a real mileage killer. Switch to synthetic oil. Your engine and your pocket book will love it. Install a K&N air filter. Many performance mods will decrease your mileage. Think about the consiquences before you install any mods. There's probably more but that's all I can think of off the top of my head.

Steve

 

Complete offtopic, but what 15" wheels are 10 lbs apiece? That seems really low.

 

xx

 

i only drive around in circles on this island and get about 27mpg with about 270 miles per tank

 

[quote="Max"]Just ask the Prius drivers, their numbers are much further off. The problem is with the EPA's testing. They give out the ratings, not the manufacturer. Most cars are off, but it's a percentage. Thus, as the estimated mileage gets higher, so will the drop in mileage.

Yes, the EPA testing is a problem, but remember the mileage numbers given are estimates and there are enough disclaimers to tell anyone not to trust these figures 100%.

As someone who has driven a Prius about two weeks a month for the past year, I can tell you that on the Prius chat boards, the mileage debate is not far different from the one seen here. My experience has been that with 60/40 city/highway driving, ours averages anywhere from 48-52 mpg. Not that far off from the EPA figures. My partner who is the primary Prius driver, has a much more aggressive driving style than I do.

Driving the Prius actually makes you more aware of how your style affects gas consumption. The NAV/info screen on the dashboard can show you either the battery's charging status OR your average consumption and kilowatt hours generated in five minute increments. There are Prius owners who literally wire their laptops to the computer systems in the car and map out their electric and gas consumption tank by tank. Believe me both of us have better things to do with their time ( I for one spent much of it now on SL.com while I wait for my Blue Onyx Pearl Xb to arrive in Denver!)

Face facts: the XB is almost the total opposite aerodynamically compared to the Prius, whose shape is carefully calculated to cut gasoline consumption every minute it is in motion. That's why they don't offer a sunroof, tires and wheels larger than 15s,
etc. When you start tacking on larger dubs, tires,etc, you're going to affect mileage. Skis on the roof rack, boogie boards, surf boards, a portable sound system for 100 of your best friends in the cargo area will all negative impact it. So, take the advice and reduce the weight you're carrying, leave the crap off your roof and drive sensibly (doesn't mean you can't go a little crazy now and then on the highway with speed or fast starts from a red light in the 'burbs.)