lvbitwiz

Thank you Chadfo

danos_XBox

zio! I worked at Ford as a certified parts man. Ask any dealership foreign or domestic and they will tell you. Ford sells crap but train their techs and parts men well.

You are incorrect sir. Any electrical failure due to a system heat control problem(s) (design flawed) is covered by your car manufacturer. The system is designed to withstand, under the hood normal temps, for length of warranty.

If said failure is found to be caused by a poor engineering error. The car dealership must cover the issue.

P.S. If you cause the problem by tampering with the system, (I do not know anyone who would do this or sell something that would change the design) then you have voided and forfeit the warranty.

miketf1

no you didnt provide facts and solutions. Kiiski asked legitimate questions and you responded by calling it all "drivel". stop pushing us to buy your design cause here why it doesnt make any sense:
1. you cut a hole in a location where there contains a foam backing for low speed crash resistance. looking at your picture i looks like its still there. product fail?
2. you say the center bumper section deflects air into the grill that lets no air in. why not just REMOVE THE UPPER GRILL? therefor it deflects air INTO THE ENGINE BAY
3. any design flaw is covered by toyota. if your car gets messed up in any way that is because of them no matter if your warranty is up, they will fix it. look at all the recalls that applied to cars far past their warranty end date.
4. by removing the foam piece and cutting 2 holes youve just induced some massive drag. you yourself have said that the engine bay is sealed well. packing more air in with 2 new holes means more drag. i dont need computations to get that conclusion.

honestly if your biggest worry is burning up the wiring then just take the bumper off. it provides no crash resistance and whats left behind is your crumple zones anyways. safe and cool. thats what all the cool people are doing.

zio

lol at u fools.

Whateva! my car will last longer than yours PBBBTT!!

Bashers and haters- You guys...

Question Kiiski- If I introduce a flow of fresh air that is greater than before, say- 30'ft3/sec and give it an exit point does that make hotter or colder in an engine bay? I'm trying to cool it off in there and I was wondering if you were reading any of this at all. Have you heard of the benefits of a cold air intake? well it's like that only better, it can cool off everythin in the engine bay.

Besides if Scion wants to know how to make their cars last longer I could tell them, or show them.

I am done experimenting, if you want those specific flow numbers- do it yourself. I've taken a month fiddling around with this already and I am done. Not like I'm getting paid for it.

Mike- what? Are you ok man- I already explained the foam thing- two small pieces does not change the crash rating u loser. If there was a nickle for everytime some american was taken advantage of by someone plunked into my bank account I could just give you a billion dollars- most americans are very dumb- too much TV i'd guess. Programmed to trust and to tattle on each other. As is happening in here.

You'd have to prove your design flaw in court- something I don't want to waste time doing I'd rather just fix it. I am a scientist.

You're the drag in here I am trying to help.

lol at your take the bumper off comment- you must be from this country to say something that stupid. Not only did I not remove my bumper, my mod is simple inexpensive and done.

If you have removed the upper grill you will notice the very top of the radiator and more than halfway down the hole you will see the top of the radiator, while my vent holes direct the flow of air through the CENTER of the radiator through the HOLES in the fan shroud, geez- I though you'd at least look at your car's engine compartment before trying to trash me. The minimalistic drag introduced is exactly what it should be if you had a hole there to cool off the engine bay better. My grill helps with that, it deflects some small percentage of the air, but allows most of it through.

Any XB would look like crap without grills right? Mine did before I grilled my vents- now it looks sweet, everyone says so.

35K miles huh- wow some warranty! you'd think scion would stand behind it's products better- sounds like a volkswagon with it's 20k base warranty. Even hyundai has a 100k warranty.

Remember you'd have to prove the product failure was a direct cause of a design failure- good luck with that, I'd rather just mod it a bit and avoid the headache- besides if I posted exactly how to prove it I'd be hurting scion not helping them, maybe all those highly paid engineers can see what they are doing wrong but none of them would admit it cuz they'd get fired~

This has been fun guys see you L8ter.

Zio

zio

I wasn't selling on this site- I was selling on another- where the ad was listed and is not on your server or on scionlife.

I am at 33 posts now and will hit 50 before the months' end I'm sure.

The "selling" in the classifieds means "selling" in the classifieds, like an ad right?

Linking or providing links to other sites was not discussed, I didn't see that anywhere.

Those are private sales on another website- Or maybe you can define it better for someone who isn't in the good ol boys club yet-

Zio

zio

Good then you KNOW how hard it is to prove a "design" failure to get something covered under warranty- how many times did that happen at your shop? NM it was FORD right? lol at those geys happened all the time there. Failure in a job well done.

Zio

zio

Lets start with these..

https://www.scionlife.com/forums/vie...92267&start=20
https://www.scionlife.com/forums/viewtopic.php?t=202123
https://www.scionlife.com/forums/viewtopic.php?t=213214

Follow this thread for a while and you will see additional issues arrise that other REAL people are having you guys.

Zio

Like I had to do that- you guys were asking for it.

GoldieBox

Golly gee, I must have gotten the only good xB Scion made...

chadfo

Advertising defined: the action of calling something to the attention of the public especially by paid announcements.
Posting on Scionlife that you are selling something regardless of the actual location of sale is an ad just like it would be if you listed it in the local paper or made a tv commercial. It's just a different media.
As with most things in life it's how you approach it. You posted your link and promotional verbiage many times in a thread you started about what you are selling. That's very conspicuous and that's what the Classifieds section of this site is for.

chadfo

On another note, the tone of this thread needs to change or it will be locked. When it's just information and ideas being shared and refuted it's fine. The name calling and directed comments have to go.

Zio this is not to single you out. This is for everyone participating in this thread.

chadfo

Zio,
You mention specifically that your holes are intended to provide more air flow through the center of the radiator. The radiator only controls the cooling of the engine internals not the engine bay. The stock setup seems to keep the engine temp pretty stable in my car. If you your mod does provide more cooling, the thermostat will simply close and keep the temperature stable per the design. What have you gained?

I think your hood louvers are going to provide the most impact on the engine bay temps that you are desiring. When you are about to cut the louvers think about the noise level inside your car. If you remove the hood pad and cut holes, I can almost guarantee you will get a significant increase in noise inside the cabin. Fender vents will get you more engine bay cooling and I'm pretty sure less noise issues.

Kiiski

30'3/sec is a potential, you are assuming an uninterupted laminar airflow, which you don't have, the radiator sitting behind the grill negates "uninterupted" immediately. All car companies do wind tunnel testing, of which airflow through the engine compartment is one aspect, baffeling, again, such as a shaped fascia, can help direct airflow and keep it from turbulating, keeping it laminar, which helps it flow through a system such as a radiator. A turbulant flow can easily decrease airflow through the radiator, the turbulance creates a high pressure area that can become a dead zone which can prohibit further airflow from passing through the radiator, regardless of your exit packets, remember we are talking THROUGH not against, bugs on your radiator is only showing strikes, not flow-through, and is a poor indicator of performance.
What you DON'T know is whether or not cutting holes in your fascia has created a turbulence where there once was a more laminar flow.

Judging by your comment on getting the flow numbers myself, you obviously didn't test this yourself, you are making assumptions and calling them proven fact, that is a problem, at least you where smart enough not to mention additional cooling on your ebay ad, which would be an unsubstantiated claim. So I guess your statement about not putting anymore time into this because your not making any money off this will change with your first sale?

I, as do most of the people reading this thread understand FULLY what you are trying to do, make your engine bay cooler, understood, understood, understood. The point I am trying to get across is that a bigger hole isn't always a better idea.
You understand thermal properties, I understand aerodynamics. I am not bashing your knowledge of heat damage one bit, I am simply trying to share some of MY knowledge of aerodynamics, letting you know you may have created an airflow problem. There is no doubt a bigger hole will let more air be pulled by the fan at zero forward speeds, it's when you start moving forward and start creating pressure and possible turbulance is where you may have a problem.

Now lets assume that you are getting more airflow through the engine compartment, We are blasting down the freeway now, middle of summer, heading over the mountain passes to do some tubin', ahhhh, the surface of the block is much cooler, thank you zio, the sensors are cooler, the outer surfaces of everthing is cooler. HMMMMM, says the thermostat, I'm below my optimum operating temperature, better close. Wow, now we have a cool surface area, but over heated internally, man, my bearings and seals are cooking! Hmmmm, I have a high pressure zone in front of my radiator, the t-stat opens, allows more water through the radiator, but it isn't cooling because of the dead zone, fan kicks on, well i'm pulling air now, but it's that hot air in front that isn't moving around, there's too much of a pressure differential to pull air through, so I'll use the path of least resistance, which is the engine compartment. Things are getting even hotter now, red lights coming on, steam from the cap, busted hoses. The dealership goes through the whole car, finds nothing mechanically that would have caused overheating. Must have been those holes. Not covered. Oops.

That is a possible scenario. Or it could be hey I'm running great, I'm nice and cool in the summer, maybe a bit too cool in the winter, but my owner forsaw that and made some covers for my grill enhancements. I'm a happy little motor, and will run for hundreds of thousands of miles without a glitch, there's a broken down 08 xB, should have used my mod. It sure was insiteful for Scion to increase the grill size on the 2010 xB after all of the money they lost on warranty repairs/recalls for the overheating issues they had with 08s.

I may/may not have increased are flow over my block and sensors, I may/may not have increased flow through my radiator. I may/may not have caused a condition where it never reaches proper operating temperatures.

I hope it works out for you, personally I don't believe you have measurably increased airflow. You probably haven't decreased airflow. My guess, having worked with airflow and dynamics of flow for years, and again, it's guess, is that you now have a unique look to your xB, that doesn't run any cooler than anyone elses.

Again, you are making assumptions and calling them fact, then telling everyone else they are fools for not listening to you, stating factually that your car runs cooler than everyone elses. You do not know that to be fact.

Kiiski

ShaffNasty

...

ShaffNasty

...

ShaffNasty

"And people like Shaftnasty- go find some other thread to downrate, you got burned earlier do you want more? sizzle sizzle... Did you even graduate high school? "

Burn??? the only thing burning is supposedly your engine... and yes i did graduate high school/college your royal highness...

Sizzle sizzle??? are you semi-retarded? or is it just a social thing?

wrczx3

Zio, I see a couple of times that you insinuate that Americans are stupid, where are you from?

miketf1

these are called fallacies. you have not proved that your design is better through logic, you have attempted to prove it through name calling.

i am not a scientist. ive played with CFD programs and i got a C- on my second year physics class. i tried to point out 4 points that make your design flawed to me.

http://www.iihs.org/research/topics/bumpers.html
the insurance institute for highway safety tests for low speed crashes. that foam piece is a crash structure. the point of it is to reduce repair costs at low speed crashes. imagine hitting someone at like 10MPH without that foam piece. the bumper would fully collapse and there will be possible collapsing in the crossbeam and by design the airbags would deploy.

also, i dont know about your cold air intake argument. intaking cooler denser air for better combustion doesnt exactly make sense. to achieve the cooler air you place the source in a location further from the engine bay. by putting these two as equivalents you would have to put the radiator further from the engine bay.

i dont know Kiiski but he used proper logic to construct an argument. zio you did too for the first two pages then you did pages and pages of ad hominem fallacies. if you provided pictures of how to do it, how it reacts to the radiator you would convince a lot more members. same way the sentra se-r guys brought the problem of the broken vvt problem. they used pics dyno charts and independent repair invoices. please use logic to prove your point not fallacies.

::edit:: this is getting out of hand. you went to all the air intake threads to push you idea. i hope you understand how the intakes work and the point of an aftermarket intake is so that you can defend your point.

ShaffNasty

^ of course he does... He is a scientist!

zio

yeah,

True I could be like other people, but I'm better than those dweebs, I just fix it because I think before I do things, and then I implement my thoughts into actions.

I can see the active flow in my head and how it changes, and the vents are great.

I like em my friends like em and I know they will help in the long run, many other people are having this smelly problem and have been ignored for months on this forum, I saw so many sad posts where you guys who are bashing me gave bad advice on what it could be, without looking at the blocked fresh air flow & sealed engine compartment creating a "heat blanket" design as a fault.

Zio

zio

You guys are such haters.

Lots of other people have been reporting this smell issue and you chastise me for it.

Sounds like you're trying to ignore a real problem.

I used a wind tunnel test too, it's called a gas pedal.

Smell gone- case closed.

Zio