drivexB

Scion needs to make an AWD or RWD vehicle
Preferable AWD, I would get one again if they did

drviolin

I suppose so, but what would justify the expense and trouble of doing that, considering cars are so cheap in the US (and usually people bring cars back from the US if they happen to have been there for work). Sorry to digress.

pams

you said that cars are cheap in USA, but it is not true. I saw that in Europe the cars are cheaper and better than in USA

djct_watt

^ Try living in Thailand where a Yaris sets you back $USD20k, a 4cyl Camry $36K, and an a basic Mercedes C class, BMW 3 Series, Mini Cooper, or any non-partner country imported car costs over $100k+.

And it's that way for a lot of asia. . . unless you're buying Tata, Geely, or Cherry, cars are far cheaper in the USA. . . and because people keep cars here longer, the used market sucks. It's really unheard of (unless you're absolutely out of your mind) to be trading in cars every 3 years like most people do in the US (which destroys the used market by flooding it with cars).

drviolin

Unfortunately, it's not really so. First of all, every country in Europe has its own prices. Second, the level of equipment in Europe is not to be compared with what you get in the US for much less money. Even European cars are almost 50% cheaper in the US. Believe me, I know, for I have lived in Europe and owned cars on both sides of the Atlantic. This is why so many try to bring cars back from the US (and not all European countries make it easy or even possible). But you don't have to take my word for it - just check the prices online.

drviolin

AWD would be great for winter. In Japan you can get most cars with AWD, including "Scion"

drviolin

That's right. Japan is a whole different story, it seems. Buying a car is cheap - keeping it is very expensive, though. There is not much of a used market for anything, as the Japanese like to buy everything new and not keep it for too long. The Russian market for used Japanese cars is a godsend for Japan, as is the US for used Japanese pianos.

808-213-503

Follow up on sales chart, this time with total Toyota USA sales included, and with more complete data filled in. Data before the total Toyota line starts, is spotty with many gaps.

Seems to me, that Toyota as a whole is suffering from an image/quality issue that is denting sales all around, including Scion brand.

djct_watt

True, you will notice the swings hit with similar timing. However, you will also notice the percentage losses are significantly higher with scion. Except for the final slump, scion leads in % change for downward trends, except for a few areas.

Sciond

no matter how you spin it..it does not bode well...OTOH crazy as it is BUick is up 56% for YOY sales so go figure

JDMJim

GM as a whole is up. that fabricated story about the TOyota's gas pedal issues didn't help much.

drviolin

The whole thing with GM was and is a scam. And Toyota's gas pedal "problem" was indeed fabricated. I wonder if it was all a conspiracy to boost GM (Garbage and Manure) sales.

JDMJim

well, regardless, I would like to see Toyota design cars that are exciting

drviolin

Well, the original xB was (and is) pretty exciting. And the Yaris Verso (not sold in the US), which is really an bB/xB in a different body, was a groundbreaking, exciting design.

Sciond

So you missed the story about Toyota buying cars and burying evidence?
Audi, Ford was real and Toyota's was fake?

JDMJim

i heard of a bunch of Prius's that had black boxes showing depressed gas pedals at time of impact. more than half as a matter of fact. the fact that that was all over the news here in Chicago, but not one local case in Chicago? I'm sure media was LOOKING for someone to have an issue here which never seemed to materialize

drviolin

For some mysterious reason, those incidents of "stuck gas pedal" were only taking place in the US. Does that say something to you?

Tomas

The first thing that would make me look at (as an engineer) would be to see if there were any differences between the USDM and the rest of the world's Toyotas, and it turns out there actually is: The gas pedal assemblies on the US made Toyotas appear to be made to a different design by a different manufacturer...

(There also appeared to be a higher level of idiocy and fraud involved, and some dealer and end user problem with using floor mats that flopped over the gas pedal and held it down, and of course the potential problem with shifting control, ignition control, and braking delay all being computer run on the models with problems instead of things like the ignition switch actually being a switch that directly controlled power...)

Honestly there were legit problems caused by some questionable engineering, but that was not the whole thing - a lot of it was simply twits driving cars.

drviolin

I think it was mostly the latter (even though I had a Ford Taurus that used to accelerate unexpectedly - but that was a Ford Taurus!).

Sciond

I can honestly say I had a Ford Thunderbird SC (315lbs tq) run away on me. There was later on a recall for them(rapid acceleration). If it was smoke and mirrors why is Toyota buying up the cars with confidentiality agreements?