Bigfieroman

Anyone have access to the factory alignment specs? If so, would you mind posting them here/PMing them to me/e-mailing them to me?

CIONIDE

iTrader: (1)

PM sent.

CIONIDE

iTrader: (1)

I have specs for everything, but the only thing that is adjustable on the xB is the Toe degree.

Front Toe Range: -0.09 to +0.09
Front Total Toe: -0.18 to +0.18
Rear Toe Range: 0.00 to +0.33
Rear Total Toe: 0.00 to +0.67

If Camber is off, it can only be adjusted with Camber Bolts, or Camber Plates. Mine was off a little bit, but it drives straight and doesn't pull, so the shop said not to worry about it. I was told that if I drove in a straight line for 40K miles that I would have some uneven tire wear. They said to just make sure I rotate my tires regularly, which I do.

I also have about 3 times the normal amount of Caster (once again not adjustable), but I was told not to worry about that either; that it would actually help when I go to a larger tire and wheel package.

HOLD EVERYTHING: I JUST REALIZED THAT THESE GUYS USED THE SPECS FOR A 1st GENERATION xB. I'M GOING TO HAVE TO LOOK INTO THIS...

At the very least, they told me that the only variable on the xB that can be adjusted is the front toe, and that ideally it should be 0.0, which is what they adjusted mine to.

Bigfieroman

It is weird that the camber in front cannot be adjusted, normally the knuckle can move relative to the strut, allowing camber adjustibility. They may be mistaken. The camber bolts I have seen use this method of adjustment, the eccentric washer on them just allows it to be done in a more exact/scientific fashion, as opposed to the "best guess" type of adjustment.

If it truly is not adjustable at the strut, than plates would be the only way to adjust camber in the front.

CIONIDE

iTrader: (1)

I don't know squat about it, I'm just passing along what the technician told me.
The shop came highly recommended by the ScionLife Sponser that did my spring install.

Bigfieroman

I will give everyone the full story once I lower my car in a week. It is just inconceivable that front camber is non-adjustable.

But, if anyone has the proper specs for the 2008 xB, that would be super.

Bigfieroman

Amazing...after reviewing (zoomed to 400%) some pics taken at Randode's about 9 months ago, it appears that front camber is indeed non-adjustable. I am not sure if this is common practice now-adays, but I find it very surprising either way.

Also, toe should not change much with lowering...I bet the changes made to your alignment were minimal, right Cionide?

I will decide later, but I don't even think I will bother with an alignment after this.

CIONIDE

iTrader: (1)

Before alignment my left front toe was -0.35 and my right front was -0.25, after adjustment both are at 0.00!

I'm wondering if non-adjustable front camber was in some way a cost saving measure on the part of Scion...

Bigfieroman

Non-adjustibility on front camber may be common on modern cars, but this is my first new car...most of the struts I have seen have some adjustibility built in.

a little negative toe like you had before alignment is acceptable; it increases stability, especially at high speed. I still haven't decided if I will get an alignment after my upgrade.

I assume the entire rear is non-adjustable.

CIONIDE

iTrader: (1)

A little negative front toe would be OK, but I was 3-4x recommended specs (at least for a 2004-06 xB).
I'm going to leave it where it is for now, and maybe go to -0.05 on my next alignment.

According to the tech that did mine, the rear is completely non-adjustable.

Bigfieroman

In that case, the specs must be in inches, not degrees. If that is the case, he is right, -0.35 is too much.

I wonder if the 2008 xB specs are 0 toe as well.

You know Cionide...given our recent threads, we should just have a "Bigfieroman and CIONIDE" discussion forum to ourselves.

MikeInABox

Yeah I have a good story about the non-adjustability of torsion beam suspension. I got rear-ended in my VW, just appeared to be cosmetic damage, so they didn't check the alignment during repairs. Next time I went to rotate my tires, the left rear tire was worn way way on the inside of the tire. Took it in for alignment and the one arm of the torsion beam was bent and they had to replace the whole thing. The only thing way you can adjust anything on torsion beam is camber by way of plates that go between the arm and the hub.

I do find it crazy that camber can't be adjusted on the front. I'm going to install my springs tomorrow, so I'll look and see. I know on the instructions for the TRD springs it says not to push/pull on the strut so you can retain the factory camber settings. Weird.

I don't know how different the 1st-gen xb is as far as front suspension, but I don't think I would want to base mine off the specs for a 1st gen. I don't think I'm going to worry about alignment unless the car pulls or I notice abnormal tire wear when I rotate my tires. I'm installing Tanabe NF's and it's ~1" drop up front, not that big. If I had DF's I might get an alignment. My VW was dropped a little over 2" and the aligntment was just a little bit off up front prior to alignment.

CIONIDE

iTrader: (1)

On the computer print out, they're listed as degrees, for what it's worth.

Bigfieroman

https://www.scionlife.com/forums/viewtopic.php?t=210989

CraigMBA

Hot. Thanks.

2Hip

I hate to bring back an old thread but I'm puttiing my springs on soon and I have a couple questions regarding alignment afterwards:

1. Should I get a 4 wheel or front only alignment?
2. Leave the stock wheels on for the alignment or the new wheels? Any drawback to not having the new wheels for the alignment?
3. Are the specs listed above for an '08 or should I just refer to the thread with the pics of alignment specs?

CIONIDE

iTrader: (1)

The only alignment point that is adjustable for the 08/09 xB is the front toe.

The 2nd-Gen alignment specs are "Stickied" in the "Suspension & Handling" forum (thanks to Bigfieroman) for our 2nd-Gen xB's. The alignment specs I listed above are for the 1st-Gen xB; don't use them.

Put on your new wheels/tires and have it aligned to the specs Stickied, you'll be fine. (They're the same ones you're talking about in the other thread.)

2Hip

So Cionide should I tell the shop I only want a front end alignment and refuse a 4 wheel?

Is there any chance they would scratch my new rims while doing the alignment? I'm not really sure what happens when an alignment is done.

Thnx

CIONIDE

iTrader: (1)

The shop I went to checked all 4-wheels, and adjusted my front toe for $60.

I'm still on steelies, say I can't say about your rims.

NoLimitzBuilt

Here is something that I was told yesterday that makes alot of sense also. I am having some rear toe problems on the xB.

I took it to the shop that has always done my alignments for me. He brought up a good point. When you take a solid rear beam like ours. At stock height it is straight up and down. When you lower it, it now rolls that beam forward alittle bit. It now turns your camber into a toe issue. So the lower you go the more that the beam rotates and makes the camber/toe issue worse. He is going to look and see if there is something he can do on mine to help me out a little back there. He said he can put washers in there, but does not want to do that to mine as he has seen them loosen up. I am going to go drop it off tomorrow morning and he is going to see what can be done.

also when my rear end actually rubs in the back. It is not on the top of the fenders like you would think. It rubs up by the door area. Show you how much the rear end rolls when it goes up and down.